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Post by janetgeorge on Dec 24, 2006 20:16:00 GMT 1
Now this one I COULD do with some ideas on! If it happens again, I need more things to try. I have a gorgeous RID filly - home bred. This is her - Indigo Tralee Rosebud (aka Maggie!)  She has a lovely temperament - good as gold - don't think I've ever given her even a tiny slap! She will do anything I ask her (almost). She graded extremely well at the breed inspections this year, and of course then had to be vetted! DISASTER! Vet heard an unusual heart murmur on 'hard' exercise. At first he thought it was insignificant - but then consulted his cardiology books and started worrying it might be a heart defect. SO, trip to the best Veterinary Cardiologist in the country was scheduled. The plan was she would be exercised, he would listen, and if HE thought it was a 'problem', then she would be scanned. Day came and she loaded beautifully - her first time on a lorry. She travelled beautifully - didn't hear her so much as move a foot. We got to the Veterinary Clinic and ... she refused to get OFF the lorry!!  I tried practically everything short of hitting her - which I couldn't bring myself to do. She didn't barge around, she didn't do anything 'naughty' - she just planted her toes and refused to step down the 6 inches from the box onto the ramp! She didn't seem particularly frightened, or upset, or defiant. The ramp was on the vet's very fancy unloading ramp - so it wasn't steep. Vet thought it was very funny - I was seriously embarrassed! But he cheerfully brought his kit up into the lorry and we scanned her there. No heart defect which was great news. Drove home. And - she refused to get off the lorry. We tried food, we tried bringing her friend to the foot of the ramp and then leading her away, we tried leaving her completely loose with the ramp down - went and had a coffee - came back. Tried lunge line behind her - even tried backing her out! EVENTUALLY - more than an hour later - a combination of lunge line around her bum, with husband giving good pull when told, me with a soft rope on each front leg - bringing one forward - then the other - and off she came. Now I SHOULD have put her straight back on - and taken her off again. But it was dark, I was tired, husband was TOTALLY pi**ed off (main reason) - so I didn't. And I haven't tried to load her again (yet) because I just haven't had a day when I had 8 hours to spare!  Of course, next time she may refuse to get on - or she may walk straight up. And she MAY walk straight down. But - if we get a repeat ...... any suggestions? Has anyone had this problem with a first time loader? (I have, but it has always been easily overcome wiwth time and patience.) She's not tiny either - about 16.1 at last measuring - and still growing! |
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Post by magicgirl on Dec 24, 2006 20:25:56 GMT 1
I had the same problem with a TB mare I bought who had never left home before. She was as good as gold to load and travel but it took a long time to peruade her to come down the ramp. It was nearly 30 years ago but I don't remember her being a problem after that.
Could you back your lorry up to the gate to your school and try to unload her there. If she won't come down the ramp block in the sides so that the only way she can go is into the school. Untie her and leave her to it. I used to find with some of my ID's they had to think about something long and hard, work it out in their own time and then they were fine. It was not a case of being thick but just being comfortable with the option offered. Good luck
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Post by mags on Dec 24, 2006 20:46:32 GMT 1
Will she follow another horse down?
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Post by eskimo on Dec 24, 2006 20:49:50 GMT 1
I think sometimes practice makes perfect when it come to loading. You may find she has no problems with loading or coming off as she may understand what is expected of her now.
I'm am interested in the Heart condition though & who saw her. I have myself a IDxTB with AF & Ventricular Tachycardia he was retired last year he went to Gloucester to see a leading Cardiologist. Unfortunately all the treatment they gave him failed so he had to be retired at 12YO. I have had a major interest in horse heart conditions & there effects ever since.
She's a lovely girl.
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Post by janetgeorge on Dec 24, 2006 21:19:01 GMT 1
Could you back your lorry up to the gate to your school and try to unload her there. If she won't come down the ramp block in the sides so that the only way she can go is into the school. Untie her and leave her to it. Certainly a possibility - although our school is in use for most of the day - and I wouldn't dare do it at night in case she fell off and hurt herself. Possibly - if there was one on with her - on the day, though, she wouldn't come down for her bestest friend. We didn't dare take her UP the ramp in case we ended up with two up there refusing to come down! Ah - she hasn't got one. It was just an atypical murmur. She saw Mark Patteson at Bushy Equine Clinic - probably the same as yours. Sorry to hear about him - heart conditions that cause trouble are relatively rare in horses. |
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Post by Casper on Dec 24, 2006 21:28:39 GMT 1
Clicker training? Have to say, think she looks absolutely stunning!
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Post by jill on Dec 24, 2006 21:35:44 GMT 1
I think if you load her sometime when you have a couple of hours to spare, then ask without any pressure at all she'll come off okay. You know how it is - even if you are forcing yourself to stay calm, they can tell. Just keep a "float in the rope" and I reckon she will come off okay, just needing to find her own best way to do it. Straw on the ramp wouldn't be a good idea coming down, but have someone just taking care of the end of the rope and carry on with normal routine if it doesn't happen straight away - mix other horse's feeds etc but don't put ANY pressure on her at all.
I bet she'll surprise you.
Once years ago two of us were trying for an hour to load a 2 year old. The minute we said "Lets take a break" and sat down on the ramp, he just wandered in between the two of us. Pressure meant scarey to him.
Clicker training is a good idea if she won't just mooch onto the ramp - just reinforce the first step and the rest will follow easy as pie. It's the first step they find so hard, same as getting on the ramp.
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blueali
Olympic Poster
water horse vs. land horse
Posts: 822
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Post by blueali on Dec 24, 2006 22:17:12 GMT 1
Firstly can I have her, no bad me, no horses! She is so lovely and sounds very ID.
Well, Blue likes to stand at the top of the ramp and look around, and now one of the polo ponies seems to have started doing it to. They do come off after a minute or sooner if I tell them to come along so its not a problem. But both of them walk down hills very slowly, I always thought Blue was slow but she is speedy compared to Carlin. Both (especially Carlin) also have a huge sense of self preservation. So now I've read your thread I'm thinking all this is linked. I know Blue stalls and looks the other way when I present her with an obstacle she thinks is really difficult, I then have to get her to really focus on me and the task in hand but I don't rush her to solve the problem as long as she is considering it.
So if I were you I would try to find her some steepish slopes to walk down and see how she deals with it. If it is the step bit, perhaps find a small drop. If it is the 'terrain' as such it would be safer and easier to practise on solid ground.
I've seen your website so you obviously know the ID mind, and especially with this filly there is no ill intention, more like just not understanding how to do it.
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Post by eileen on Dec 24, 2006 22:36:28 GMT 1
Sorry Janet, dont have anything to add to the above but i did find it funny, bless her, she probably thought, i got on for her and now she thinks im getting off again......on yer bike! :-)LOL! hope you get it sorted eileen xx
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Post by eskimo on Dec 25, 2006 0:53:08 GMT 1
Yep the same guy i must say he is very very good & thorough. He treated my horse brilliantly even though things didn't turn out the way i had hoped at least i still have him he's an expensive lawn-mower now lol, Mark had him the week before x-mas last year. Glad she's OK!!  |
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Post by felicia on Dec 25, 2006 2:35:53 GMT 1
Could you take her part way up the ramp and then turn her around, if she's not too big, and bring her down again so she doesn't have to do the scary stepping out of the lorry onto the ramp bit! You could then just build it up bit by bit until she understands exactly what you want and feels comfortable with it.
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xxx
Novice Poster
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Post by xxx on Dec 25, 2006 2:40:58 GMT 1
why not just let her stand at the top til she decides she wants to go down? Repeat at home until she is confident, then she should begin to unload easier.
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Post by spanishmustangsuk on Dec 25, 2006 8:54:18 GMT 1
Could you take her part way up the ramp and then turn her around, if she's not too big, and bring her down again so she doesn't have to do the scary stepping out of the lorry onto the ramp bit! You could then just build it up bit by bit until she understands exactly what you want and feels comfortable with it. Yes, that is what I would suggest. Make time in your schedule to teach her step by step. I have recently read a few books where trainers highlight the fact that people spend months if not years training their horses for dressage etc, but hardly any time teaching their horses to load and unload. Or they just teach it to load, and wonder why it doesn't unload. So a step up, and off again...two steps up and off again, etc. easier with a trailer, harder with a lorry, where the horse would have to turn on the ramp...usually big long steep ramp, too. |
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Post by mags on Dec 25, 2006 9:04:15 GMT 1
Not sure how safe it would be to turn a big filly round on a ramp...there not exactly wide, step or 2 forward and shes off the side. Id also be concerned about the fillie getting confused about what you want by turning round half way up
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jo
Novice Poster
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Post by jo on Dec 25, 2006 10:38:05 GMT 1
Would it be that your filly doesn't know where her feet are? She's not confident backing up or placing her feet...won't think about them or can't.
perhaps start teaching on ground over tarpaulin then a raised ramp one foot on and off, two feet on and off, three etc
so you are automatically teaching her to load forwards and backwards at the same time. The progress back to the lorry, she would prob walk straight on and off again!
People always seem to teach a horse to load by end goal of gettin horse IN and don't teach the OUT! I saw a young filly once being loaded with a broom in the end because she dared to hesitate to check out the ramp, the escalation in pressure convinced her enough to go forwards but then when she needed to turn she tried to escape...through the partially open window and put her head through it...I mean smash her head through it. This was all on her way to a yard to be broken.
As far as getting your filly off I would have definately been patient, done less that you would have already tried, and a cuppa coffee sitting at the yard, parked with entrance to a field even and just waited her out. I don't believe she would have injured herself coming off as long as she was left to it...sounds too not bovvered to jump off but would maybe have put straw all over and bales up against the side of the ramp. I wouldn't make it uncomfortable for her inside the lorry but would def not have any hay in there! Also would leave untied and just wait her out...I bet it wouldn't have taken nearly as long as you think!
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