nimmo
Novice Poster
Posts: 32
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Post by nimmo on May 10, 2006 10:40:32 GMT 1
You are more than welcome to come and meet my "barking" arabs, they are shown at arab shows but guess what, they are totally sane. My vet and farrier never bother if I can't be there because they know there won't be any problems.
Please don't tar all owners with the same brush ... it is totally possible to show your horses in that atmosphere, for them to show off, and still have extremely well adjusted horses who are very happy with life.
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Post by kas on May 10, 2006 11:12:40 GMT 1
I think you're missing the point. A lot of non-Arab people will base their perception of the breed on what they see at shows. What they see is horses that are hyped up to be shown at their "best". Among the horses that look good in the adrenalin-charges atmosphere fostered by the handlers and the audience, there are many running about with eyes out on stalks, acting as if their handlers don't exist (for example, running on and getting yanked round when their handler turns a corner or stops). What PR is that for the noble breed? How irritated do Arab owners get when people say something negative about a horse and then add "He's just a typical Arab", and all around nod sagely? When people say "Don't buy an Arab as a riding horse, they are so highly strung and scatty" what do all us Arab owners do? We come back with all our experience of our own sane, brave and safe horses. Unfortunately, that is not the image projected by Arabian showing. Yes, it's much worse on the continent, but of course things are changing in the UK and we will surely go in that direction. I'm going to say it again - surely we want people to see our horses at their best in the showring? Should that best be a state that is only achieved by handlers hotting them up and lots of outside interference from people outside the ring? Or should it be a picture of harmony between horse and handler, with the horse showing it's amazing paces and beauty as a result? Obviously a lot of people think the first situation is the horse at it's best. I disagree and vote with my feet. One more thing on handlers and how they show Arabs - it's no coincidence that there is so much discussion on Arabian forums about excessive "shanking" of horses by the handlers.
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Post by arabheaven on May 10, 2006 11:20:54 GMT 1
How irritated do Arab owners get when people say something negative about a horse and then add "He's just a typical Arab", and all around nod sagely? When people say "Don't buy an Arab as a riding horse, they are so highly strung and scatty" what do all us Arab owners do? We come back with all our experience of our own sane, brave and safe horses. Unfortunately, that is not the image projected by Arabian showing. so true KAS arabs are scatty, can't jump, don't have brains and should never be let out on a hunt field apparently why then do arabs succeed at endurance where they are ridden in the lightest of tack, buckle end across open spaces? why then did my 14.2hh arab easily beat the 16.2hh TBs etc., at jumping? why then did everyone want to ride MY horse at PC? and why does everyone at my yard know that they can't shout at zac or hit him like they do with their horses - he is sensitive, intelligent and 110% loyal wouldnt swop my arab for ANY breed ;D *rant over now*
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Post by kas on May 10, 2006 11:30:58 GMT 1
You get my point then ;D
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kofihorse
Grand Prix Poster
Oh,such a perfect day, I'm glad I spent it with you
Posts: 1,454
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Post by kofihorse on May 10, 2006 12:21:43 GMT 1
I am in complete agreement with KAS on this one. Just because "everyone does it" does not make it right. Nor does it mean that it should have to continue. It is stupidity and laziness at the utmost to make this kind of carry-on into a supposed virtue - I don't care how many of you have horses who "enjoy" it or who manage to cope with it - it is against all sensible principles of horse-handling - end of.
Bad for the individual horses, bad for the image of the breed and dangerous to boot.
I am not especially interested in in-hand showing but as I have Khan on loan and his owner is keen for him to go, we're entered in the County Show on Saturday - I have spectated at the class in previous years and not seen any of this nonsense, just a bit of cheering when a particularly well-known horse went round but there had better not be anyone winding up Khan or I guarantee I will be demanding that they stop!!
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Post by kas on May 10, 2006 12:41:44 GMT 1
At county shows and local shows you get normal horse people who don't realise they are supposed to create a diversion ;D
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moose
Novice Poster
Posts: 0
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Post by moose on May 10, 2006 13:15:28 GMT 1
Just after I first bought my arab I went to a local Arab show with my 'more involved in the scene' friend. There were anglo arabs in the adjacent ring looking lovely under saddle and behaving perfectly. Right next door in the arab in hand there was not the cheering and shouting, stones in coke cans etc which you can all to often witness at the bigger shows. However, two people were disqualified (wrong equipment and clipped youngster), one horse got loose and did a 'wall of death' impersonation and I was at a complete loss how movement was being assessed when only a handful of horses managed to trot a length of the arena before breaking stride. Most worrying was when I witnessed a young girl handler strike her horse across the front legs with a whip In fact the only horses which were behaving in a calm and controlled way were those belonging to 'one horse owners'. If I hadn't already been an arab owner after going to that show I would have left thinking 'I'm going to get myself an anglo arab instead.' My girl is a sane, smart and willing horse and having had an arab I'd never have anything else. The arab world is constantly scratching its head and wondering how best to promote the versatility of the breed. Unfortunately the in hand showing scene is not the best forum for this. The market is flooded with lightly shown in hand not broken to ride arabs. It is the 'one horse owner' people who purchase them and progress in various disciplines who are successfully promoting the breed. I agree that it is commendable that the horses can cope with the high level of noise and chaos at the shows but am more impressed by police horse displays of calmness in the face of adversity.
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Post by kas on May 10, 2006 13:24:11 GMT 1
Not only are they not broken to ride - they're not bred to ride either! Some of the american horses in particular have such extreme conformation that many say they would be nearly impossible to ride. That's food for thought. Mind you, they enhance Arabs with plastic surgery over there...
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Post by specialsparkle3 on May 10, 2006 14:27:46 GMT 1
Kas, when I used to show Arabs we stood them out as you would a show pony or In hand Hack, we did a normal floating but controlled trot around the ring and everone could appreiate the beauty of a good, well put together Arab. I think the worst bit of stupidity I ever witnessed in the new form of Arab showing was probably the last Arab ever to go in the Breeders at HOYS- (tho' there MAY have been one since)----They chose not to go after that. This silly woman all dressed in white looking like a bunny girl, stood her horse in line with its nose stuck in the air, its back hollowed and its hind legs stuck out behind it. To achieve this "pose" the handler waved a Dressage whip over it's head. The judges walked round it and as one of them walked past the handler, he put his hand over her arm and gently lowered her stick without saying anything. The horse then relaxed, and brought it's head down showing its true outline. The judge stood back to inspect the other side, and do you know what she did?-----She stuck her stick straight back in the air!! All in all the judge removed her stick from his vision 3 times Needless to say the horse, who I seem to remember was a good Arab, was unplaced, entirely due to the handler. It was a very sad sight, and as you said,did nothing for the breed, in fact it was the laughing stock of the show
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claire
Intermediate Poster
Posts: 207
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Post by claire on May 10, 2006 17:42:56 GMT 1
I started showing arabs 7 years ago and was shocked when i went to my first show at the noise and was terrified to how my horse would react.... he loved it and trotted around the arena as if he owned, and not only was he a champion in-hand but also under saddle, since then i have trained many horses for the show ring and the noise comes as part of the training, last year at the UKIAHS my stallion took part in not nly the in hand but also the ridden, he trotted up a storm in one class and behaved like the perfect gent in the other.... arabs are clever and know when they need to play up to the crowd and love doing it. I always get peeved when i hear all the comments on the noise and the fact that as trainers and breeders we are huting our horses in someway by allowing this to continue.... i own 4 stallions and each of them hunts, competes under saddle, dressage and jump but love nothing more than being in front of a big noisey crowd and trotting forever... all break into a canter from time to time but thets fair enough when trotting at the speed and with the power they do it's just going to happen.... when our horses begin their training for the in-hand ring it's allways with alot of noise, music banging ect so they don't get fazed when going in the ring and at some training centers i've worked at the shools are also decked out with flowers and flags so the horses don't spook at them either. My stallion loved the noise at the north west show but hated the flowers should we ban these aswell cause i saw more horses scared of them than were put off by the crowds!!
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Post by kas on May 10, 2006 18:46:06 GMT 1
You're talking as if we haven't seen the big Arab shows. Your horse may love it and look good, but I know what I've seen and there were a lot of "typical arabs" on show. I'm only going to state my opinion once more, and then I'm out of this discussion - I maintain that it should be possible to show a horse at it's best without outside assistance/interference. Note I included assistance - if your horse loves the noise then it could be argued that you are being assisted from outside the ring. In my opinion a good show should be a demonstration between horse and handler. Stuff the friggin' flowers - the horses that have trust in their handlers and have been trained to be calm and brave won't have their show spoilt by objects around the ring. But they should not be assisted or interfered with by PEOPLE outside the ring, because unlike flower arrangements, people have control over their actions. I'm not interested in how well behaved these horses are at home, or how wonderfully they perform in the hunting field. I am questioning the public image of the Arabian horse as portrayed in modern in-hand showing. Jeez...
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Post by becky88 on May 10, 2006 21:43:44 GMT 1
I have 3 ridden arabs they go foot perfect and i am aiming my mare at the HOYS qualifiers this year, arabs a bred to be ridden more than inhand, they originated in the desert to carry their owner (sheikh), thats why we have the authentic costume classes at the arab shows to show their beauty. My inhand gelding will show in the ring without assistance expecially to Faithless insomnia music, and he shows wonderful without breaking trot. All arabs aren't the same and their temperment come for where they have been brought up should is say, but all in no is my arabs are as sane as anything and will do anything for me. Really this topic is upsetting me because i no i won't have any other breed, i agree with arab heaven. Lastly all i have to say is do people bother when some show ponies have their heads tide in all the time, when showjumpers do a clear round and the whole crowd clap and bang, and when driving ponies get chased by all sorts to go faster? It is just arabs that should get taled about, different horses are unique in their own way, we shouldn't put a name tag on them.
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Post by jor on May 10, 2006 22:05:55 GMT 1
becky, you have posted all of 5 posts on this board...i can assure you the ins and outs of pretty much every aspect of equine sport and care is discussed here extensively. I used to show a polish arab under saddle and worked for a good arabian stud, I still have a few connections with some very good arabian breeders and they all say that at the arab shows the amount of noise purposefully made by spectators to wind the horses up is ridiculous and I strongly agree. I do like arabs, I dont like showing arabs at arab shows because I HATE the people who are spectating that make the stupid amounts of noise. I have already said on this thread I think everyone accepts that clapping and cheers will go up when a horse wins a class...this is acceptable. Banging heels/hands, loud whooping and any sort of bags/tins etc is unacceptable IMO. What people are saying is that people who do not 'know' arabs see arabs prancing about at the end of a rope with eyes out on stalks looking ready to explode with handlers waving great huge whips about, yanking on chains and an audience making ridiculous amounts of noise and think 'ooo arent arabs sharp?' No wonder! Why arabs cant be shown for the beautiful horses they are instead of stood up and stretched out and chased up and down like some kind of toy I dont know. I am not saying that EVERYONE who shows arabs is this way but there is more than enough of it about and it DOES give a bad impression to those 'outside' the arab world. I can say I would not go back to arab showing at arab shows....I would yell murder at anyone making stupid amounts of noise.
I may also point out that all show horses/ponies, showjumpers, dressgage horses, eventers etc have to manage with flower arrangements and 'props' but most people who spectate in these fields have the courtesy and sense to keep half quiet until a horse has finnished a show...and they only usually clap and will cheer thier favorite...I would say that anyone banging and screeching when l/r ponies are going about a ring would be frowned about severly.
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Post by kas on May 10, 2006 23:45:47 GMT 1
I own a top bloodlines Arab Becky She's a star. Yes, I could talk about things I disagree about in other areas of showing, but this topic is about Arab showing. If you want to discuss others then just start another thread, I'm sure you'll get plenty of input.
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Post by jogypsy on May 11, 2006 10:33:02 GMT 1
Er, having never shown Arabs or even been to a dedicated Arab show (I just love the breed as a multi-talented riding horse)...... I've just realised that the Arab in the photo is Azlal who is my old Arab's dad and that's the first pic of him I've ever seen! I miss me George sooooo much *oooh! tears*
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