big e
Grand Prix Poster
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Post by big e on Dec 30, 2007 18:05:02 GMT 1
There are a few people on here with tunnel vision. They can't see that everyone who rides is in individual, that they have there own weaknesses and strengths and that their horses are also individuals with their own quirky characters. What works for one person may not work for another and sometimes you have to accept that and offer advice from different angles so that person may be able to find an answer that works for them. These people don't do that, i try to see things from their point of view but i just can't get my head that far up my a**e ;D
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Vic
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Ted the Horse!!!!!
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Post by Vic on Dec 30, 2007 18:05:26 GMT 1
I kind of agree with sherbertdip, i think that given the way IH works, more of a philosophy that a direct way to do stuff it can be a bit more inacessible to people just starting off, where as Parelli is an easier way to start as it gives you more precise direction, which i think if you lack a bit of confidence is a lot easier to use. But then i also think that that broader approach, once you have got into it, is what makes IH invaluable so maybe this is a comment for both sides??
I also agree with the idea that sometimes people can go a bit OTT and that can bit a bit offputting, but i think you get that from every conrner in all walks of life!!
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melissa
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Post by melissa on Dec 30, 2007 18:16:50 GMT 1
I would say it can be on the expensive side....if you don't have much money:( The courses I mean. I would have loved to have done one a couple of years ago but just couldn't sort the money.
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Post by Louise C on Dec 30, 2007 18:34:51 GMT 1
I would say it makes your brain ache - all that intelligent thinking you have to do!!!!!
TBH - I'm not sure how NH it is - Kelly leads the whole thing and she has a shod horse who wears a bit and a treed saddle at least some of the time - I know she rides in a Dually as well. But she is so open minded that as long as it works for the horse and doesn't cause pain in any way she's for it!
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Post by Claire MK on Dec 30, 2007 18:35:27 GMT 1
I don't think it's expensive - I'm not talking about courses here - just the basic idea of it. It can be done with just a headcollar and rope and probably the Perfect Manners book for ideas and groundwork exercises. I've had an RA out twice (my ponies went from being untouched and uncatchable to following me around) and sent my ponies to SarahW for them to be started. Sarah did a great job (I just need to follow up more consistently than I have done - oops!). Sarah is certainly not expensive, perhaps she should charge more - danger money, eh Sarah?! And at least you know violence isn't going to be resorted to... Keeping horses is expensive and RA's do give great value for money.
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melissa
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Post by melissa on Dec 30, 2007 18:39:33 GMT 1
Jovi - when I said expensive I meant the courses, especially when you add the extras on like transport, accommodation etc. Out of my league sadly.
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jo
Novice Poster
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Post by jo on Dec 30, 2007 18:40:57 GMT 1
I think the bad thing for me to do with IH is that it's all a bit too blurry...
I started my journey with horse/pony ownership back in 1998 and saw Monty Roberts in action at Arena UK and knew I was seeing something special. But then I got a bit lost and didn't see anything other than JoinUp, Dually halter and having a horse hook onto you.
We've moved all over the country and on yards I've not met a single person who has something positive to say about Monty Roberts (oh you mean the Horse Whisperer). They haven't even heard of Kelly Marks... so maybe the marketing isn't great. Neither is the help, I have real doubts mentioning an RA to anyone I know who has problems with their horse as I don't have the same faith that they are doing anything good...without just making a lot of money out of someone's inexperience.
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Post by Kelly Marks on Dec 30, 2007 18:45:58 GMT 1
Thanks Jovi (and everyone it's all valuable feedback) re. IH expensive and where to start - start with Perfect Manners from your library - it's got exercises that can really make a difference for you and your horse and pretty much covers the essentials. Can't afford a course? Come as a helper and you sit in on all the lectures and get to see pretty much everything going on, you're just not individually assessed. Don't like any of the clothes designs? P.M. Katie 'Gordon Ramsay' Gormley right now. Complain bitterly. Give her a hard time. What's she doing all day? Where are our trendy hoodies for the younger IH members? Heh? Why do Ian and I have to walk around looking like sad people when she could have designed something trendy for us by now? Eh?
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Post by sarahfox on Dec 30, 2007 18:53:50 GMT 1
Hehe!! I got Kelly on my thread!!
Re the comments about tunnel vision etc, do ask yourselves who is responsible for that? ( me teehee!!) is it actually a RA? Kelly? hmmmm,nope,dont think so,in which case I dont really think it fair to blame it on IH,this is a public forum and as such is not totally controlled by IH,there are MODs,yes,but they are only there to stop real nastiness/slander etc.
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Post by Claire MK on Dec 30, 2007 18:57:04 GMT 1
Wasn't just replying to you Melissa. I think it was Emily said it was expensive to have an RA out. I don't know your circumstances so I'm just speaking generally here but 'people' seem to buy bits and pieces of tack/gadgets, whatever, which *COULD* possibly cover the cost of having an RA out. Ducks and runs for cover.
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lovelylace
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Always remember to ride with your soul, not your hands.
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Post by lovelylace on Dec 30, 2007 19:00:43 GMT 1
ok here goes.... the worst bit about oit is that I think it can be seen either as a shortcut for some people and that it seems to offer a solution to all problems... when I say this I mean that I have come across a lot of people that have not got alot of horse experience and they embark on a ih journey and perhaps not always understand and execute the whole thing very well...I have seen people reading a boook and then go out and confuse their horses completely and made matters worse for the horse...this is not good and the few times when I have tried to advise you can get back that this is "natural" or "intelligent" horse manship and they are not following "traditional" methods so I wouldn't understand....hrrm, the only thing I see is a very confused horse being chased around a school in a very poor attempt to join up now there are of course bad practioners in any sphere of riding and horse keeping, but unfortunately I have come across quite a lot of misunderstood and badly performed ih...almost more than I have in any other sphere of horsemanship, sad but true......
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Post by indibindi on Dec 30, 2007 19:02:08 GMT 1
I've met Kelly, Monty and a couple of RA's. All are lovely. I think Monty is fantastic with horses and I could watch him all day and all night. however, I do not believe he is above criticism or being questioned and I don't believe HE thinks he is either. I like that. I don't think there is anything I don't like - although i don't like the idea of folk doing join up without being trained to do so first....
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Post by geeup on Dec 30, 2007 19:05:17 GMT 1
Ih is working its just taking time, loads of people have seen the transformation of my pony form nervous wreck to the beauty that she is today. You have to put up with some real wierd looks though, like th etime I lunged my pony into its partionless trailer. Or the time it occured to the show organisers we couldn't pass the crop because we didn't ride with one!!!!!!!!!!! But my daughter has learnt, whilst wathcing top riders jumping, she anlysed that those who rode quietly and didn't carry a crop all won. That you could tell which horses would win by the way they approached the first jump, in harmony with the rider, that that harmony wasn't achieved through aggression. She can even tell when we need to change the gullet of our saddle by our ponies body langauge and now rides with out gripping the reins and can rise to the trot bareback (thanks Heather and EE for that). Her freinds are starting to ask why and reading into it themselves.
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big e
Grand Prix Poster
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Post by big e on Dec 30, 2007 19:06:31 GMT 1
hmm going back to sarah fox. These tunnel vision peeps are not even quoting IH methods, i think they just come on here to b**ch and no your not one of the very few
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Post by fin on Dec 30, 2007 19:11:29 GMT 1
I'm not 100% sure about the marketing either. I think Parelli got it badly wrong by overmarketing (and managing to create entirely the wrong impression too) but the general feeling I get from IH is that there's not actually a strong idea of WHO they're marketing to (in terms of the most likely sort of people--I mean, who's a prime IH client, and how can they be contacted, by what media etc?) I say that partly because I have a mate who works at Rodbaston and she had no idea that Monty was doing a demo there til I mentioned it to her! The same thing applies to the offers in the Listening Post. I mean, yep, ten quid off a dually and a free shirt--super. BUT the voucher can only be redeemed by post, not via the web or over the phone.......now I do need another dually, but TBH I'm much too lazy to bother with an offer by post.....easier to pay the extra tenner or order the blasted thing off ebay! I think another problem is that IH is associated with Monty. This is good in most ways BUT it is going to put off other folks who won't see beyond join-up and having to have a round pen etc. Plus the demos almost always emphasise problem horses or starters--that's fine and it makes for a good show, but it automatically alienates people who DON'T have a problem or a youngster, unless they can work out for themselves that these techniques can be useful in their own non-problem situation I think ultimately though the big downfall of IH is that it needs a reasonably bright person with good critical faculties and the ability to think flexibly and process information. I'm not talking about education here, or literacy, or even the occasional feeling of having so many possibilities its all a bit overwhelming (that's normal!) but the sad fact is some people aren't comfortable thinking for themselves and would much rather rely on an authority figure telling them what to do. In IH, that doesn't work--you can do what Monty says, sure, but there'll come a point at which you have to apply the principle and not a set of rules to a situation, and I suspect a lot of people just can't or won't do that. They're far more likely to resort to Parelli or what the YO tells them to do
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