is there something I am missing???

[jennyb]

I agree with LisaP. The difficulty for me with finding anything over and above basic DIY livery is a) cost - most are ridiculous and that is coming from an accountant with a clear idea of costings and recoveries etc; and b) the YO's ideas and rules and regs about running a yard. I find I am more highly qualified than most YOs around here and yet I should be dictated to and tug my forelock about how my horse will be cared for whilst handing over a huge wad of cash - I don't think so!!! I'm so lucky that I've found a yard now which is a great compromise, I hand over decisions about turn out and bring in times, herd dynamics and so on, and in return my wishes about rugging, feeding, companions etc are taken into account. I totally get that YOs who live on site will want to decide on routine and so on, but I have very clear ideas about feeding, hoof care, management and so on and it's the hardest thing getting the two to mesh.

Having said that, I have been a relatively happy DIYer for years but have certainly had "incidents" with idiot YOs and thoughtless fellow liveries which have made my blood boil. I'm liking my current assisted/part livery arrangement, because the yard suits Gazdag and I it's just bliss!

[Amanda Seater]

That is my point though Jennyb - that is how it should be. I work with the clients wishes - we talk.
Jennyb - what would you consider expensive? I think £95 per week ( no exercising)is fair when one considers staff and overheads never mind any capital investment to improve facilities.

For those who talk of rugs etc
I ask though if you asked me to use a heavy weight rug on your horse as it is cold windy and raining hard with a horrid windchill which is fair enough and then you went on holiday or business and it stopped raining and became still and the temperature rose 10 degrees- which it can.
Would you expect me to
A) insist I just leave the same rug on if your horse was sweating and uncomfortable becasue that is the decision you had made.
B)disturb you in your business meeting/ on your dive boat to ask for permission to change the rug.
C) do my job( as I see it) and either change the rug for a lighter one or take it off for a while and keep an eye to the weather and the comfort of the horse.

The above scenario can happen on a day to day basis too if you think about how most of 2012 has been from early March right through to November.

I must say here that people have actually moved house to bring their horses to stay with me!
Incredible and I feel honoured. Others have lived hundreds of miles away.

and MANDAL - no they haven't asked again.

[jennyb]

I would expect C. I have shown YO my rugs, explained that Gazdag is a hot bod and doesn't like to be overrugged, and said they can change them according to the weather as they see fit.

£95 per week sounds quite reasonable but it depends on local costs etc - Lincolnshire is a cheap area of the country. As a comparison, I pay £50 per week for assisted DIY and I get:
- ad lib hay and straw
- basic hard feed (I only use the sugar beet and supply my own chaff though as theirs is molassed)
- use of the arena and floodlights (I use the lights 2-3 times per week for 30 mins ish)
- parking on hardstanding for my trailer
- turnout and bring in weekdays
- rug changes weekdays
- feeding morning and night weekdays
- feeding, rug change and turnout weekend mornings
- poo picking done for me mid week

So all I have to do mid-week is muck out, exercise and groom. At weekends I poo pick Gazdag's field (including YO's ponies - averages about one barrow of poo per day) and bring him in and sort him at night. I think the rates are cheap for the quality of service I am getting, for me the trust and reliability and customer care are the key things and I don't mind paying a premium for them. Oh, and they will hold him for farrier/vet/dentist etc at no extra cost. So as I feel I am getting good value for money, I will happily muck in and help out when I have time at weekends, e.g. turning out and bringing in, washing feed buckets and so on.

Part livery 5 days here (like my livery but including mucking out) is £80 per week.

[Amanda Seater]

sounds pretty much like here.
I do find it amazing that with horses and humans being so individual that a YO can dictate. For me there is a huge degree of neccessary flexibility and I am offering a service but then again I guess it is a case of the customer voting with their feet if they don't like something and it can't be changed

I guess customers can either like and embrace our general ethos ( because that won't change) or find somewhere more compatible.

[Deleted]

Dec 13, 2012 10:29:22 GMT 1 Amanda Seater said:

That is my point though Jennyb - that is how it should be. I work with the clients wishes - we talk. .

I agree. I think the thread has gone a little off topic because of Lisap's list of fellonies commited by DIYers so those of us who are DIyers and perfectly capable of caring for our horses probably felt the need to point out that some YO's who offer part and full can be as bad or worse. I wouldn't think for a moment that you're one of them

Dec 13, 2012 10:29:22 GMT 1 Amanda Seater said:

For those who talk of rugs etc
I ask though if you asked me to use a heavy weight rug on your horse as it is cold windy and raining hard with a horrid windchill which is fair enough and then you went on holiday or business and it stopped raining and became still and the temperature rose 10 degrees- which it can.
Would you expect me to
A) insist I just leave the same rug on if your horse was sweating and uncomfortable becasue that is the decision you had made.
B)disturb you in your business meeting/ on your dive boat to ask for permission to change the rug.
C) do my job( as I see it) and either change the rug for a lighter one or take it off for a while and keep an eye to the weather and the comfort of the horse.

Lisap's view was some DIYers leave their horses too hot or too cold and she has to intervene, which is fine because we know she's sensible. My view is that I know my horse best and if I arrived to find Talin wearing extra rugs (after I had rugged him adequately) because someone else thought he was cold I wouldn't be all that impressed, so while he's on part livery and I am there to rug him I don't think it's reasonable for someone else to override my decisions. Don't forget some people think horses are cold if the outer layer of their coat is cold to the touch, I wouldn't want Talin rugged more on that basis because to me it means his coat is doing it's job.

I consider myself extremely lucky (and in the minority) that my YO IS on the same wavelength as me so I can ask her to use her discretion, but if for any reason I had to leave there I honestly couldn't name one single other yard within 30mins drive where I can say the same thing and I have trawled many over the years.

[Amanda Seater]

See I wouldn't add a rug to a horse.
I am more likely to encourage a run around to get them warm if they are standing about actually shivering - that would be very unusual though.

I would make sure they all came into open the barn( which they have free access to) if they were insisting on being out in torential rain and cold wind and one was shivering and miserable.

Re off topic yes I guess we see more ishoos with DIYers simply because as a matter of statistics there are more of them than YO and managers etc.

[jen1]

i only offer 1 kind of livery, and that my kind, if folks dont like its a bit tough tits really, its simple it works and its cheap in comparison to most yards, its natural living, outdoors, 50 acre in winter feild, track in summer, new dry turn out going in, track from winter feilds to turnout sand pit will be next, i provide bedding when its needed,horses only in for about 4 hours per day i fetch in for owners feed if feed is left, dont charge extra for extras, summer is differant it more like grass livery still with your stable and everything else, horses must live as mine do, and thats it, o and i supply fast fibre but we dont feed huge amounts as they has huge amounts of ad lib hay winter ad hoc in summer, and that it, its give and take and all the liveries i have now are excellent its team spirit , ive only had 3 knobs in 3 years so 1 per year isnt bad on the whole, im just a little more careful who i take on,

[janwilky]

I don't have any experience of livery at all as I'm very lucky to be able to keep my horses at home, which has its downsides but is oh so peaceful and friendly ;D. BUT having had my horses at Amanda's twice in the last six months, once for training and now while I recuperate from my accident, I must say that if I needed my boys to be at a livery yard for any reason, and I lived near enough, I wouldn't hesitate to choose her place on whatever terms. Why? Because it's a lovely friendly, calm environment, they would be well cared for but allowed to be horses and not smothered, my wishes as owner would be respected (as long as I wasn't a complete idiot ;D), support would be there if I needed it, and not least because I know we could TALK though any issues that arose. Your neighbour is missing out on a good thing Amanda but stick to your guns - you don't want to do DIY. Period.

Oh, and she has a GALLOP track!!!!!!!!!! ;D