Any fulmer snaffle experts?!

[writingdesk]

Hello newbie here looking for a 'bit' of advice...

Can anyone show me some pics of a correctly fitting fulmer snaffle or describe how it should fit?!

I bought my horse's normal size and it seemed to be the perfect fit for an eggbutt/full cheek bit - the corners of the lips were just touching the edge of the cheek pieces but on the the third ride I noticed rubbed patches on his cheeks where tops of the cheek pieces are held by the keepers.

I bought 1/2 an inch bigger and although the cheeks pieces didn't rub this time I can fit a full index finger's width in between his lips and the cheek pieces on both sides which must mean it is too big?!

A compromise would obviously to get a 1/4 of an inch smaller - but I am worried this would still be too big as I thought full cheeks should fit quite snugly.

Secondly, is the issue of what noseband to use. At the moment my bridle has a raised, padded cavesson noseband which seems to interfer with the full cheeks - would i be better off using a drop noseband instead even though my horse doesn't need one and if so If so is it better to have the bit snug or 1/4" wider anyway?

I compete so need a noseband otherwise I'd just go without!

I really like how my horse feels in this bit - I love the compromise of full cheeks and loose rings - but obviously he needs to be comfortable!

Many thanks for your help!

[Beth&Rosie]

We were taught in pony club that you should be able to fit one finger between the lips and the ring of the bit, otherwise it is too small and could pinch. Correct me if this is different for fulmer snaffles... Just what I thought...

[Liz]

The fulmer used to be popular for use with young horses and it was supposed to help keep the head steady. Fulmer and full cheek snaffles should be used with fulmer loops which secure the top of the bit to the cheek pieces to prevent the bit from swivelling and leaving the cheeks pointing out which could be dangerous.

[june]

Don't use it with keepers. Let the bit move around so it will be less likely to rub. If you use a plain cavesson then it shouldn't interfere with the full cheeks and you may find if you do away with the keepers the padded one will be fine too.

[Deleted]

I had a similar problem with a hanging cheek, I think it's an issue when the horse has a small muzzle and their face widens out quickly above the muzzle. As June says, not using the keepers will mean the cheeks of the bit stay lower so it shouldn't be a problem.

[sharonh]

If you don't use the keepers then the whole point of having the fulmer cheeks is wasted. They are supposed to help keep a young horse straight and if they are loose they don't work as they are designed to.

[june]

No, the whole point of the full cheeks isn't wasted at all. The full cheeks still sit snugly against the side of the face and keep the bit from moving from side to side. The only difference is the bit can move in the vertical plane which often helps with comfort as the horse can move its tongue and relax its jaw more easily. The full cheeks also make the turning aid more obvious, providing both a pull on the opening rein and a push on the opposite side of the face.

[esther]

I don't use the keepers on mine either. With keepers it tends to twist the bit and create poll action on the bridle that (IMO) shouldn't be there. Whereas without keepers it can sit wherever is more comfortable in the mouth. You have got to watch that they don't get the points in their mouth but if it's fitted right they shouldn't do.

Bit size wise, I've had to go bit shopping this year for my babypony (first time I've bought a bit in ages) and found that the sizes don't seem to be consistent any more. I think I ended up getting him a 5", but I was taking the 4.5" that we'd had on him at home to compare to and the 5" was the same. It is trial and error. A bit like clothes sizes I guess.

[jill]

Jan 10, 2013 23:08:26 GMT 1 sharonh said:

If you don't use the keepers then the whole point of having the fulmer cheeks is wasted. They are supposed to help keep a young horse straight and if they are loose they don't work as they are designed to.

Could you explain that a bit more fully please? I have used fulmers in the past, always loose, never with keepers, and found they did the job just fine.

[writingdesk]

Thanks for the replies, regarding to using keepers or not, does it make a difference whether you are using a plain full cheek or a loose ring fulmer?

Esther this is the problem - I have had him in 5.5 bits or 5 3/4" bits depending on make and style but this 6" really did look enormous - didn't help that he had most of it hanging out one side of his mouth! I am not sure dropping down 1/4 of an inch will be enough but dropping 1/2 an inch will be the size that rubbed (although bit is from a different manufacturer so perhaps their 5.5 is bigger..)

It's just a pain as to exchange it I need to post it back and pay postage both ways so I really want to get it right the next time!

[mags]

I use a fulmer, without keeper loops. To me, the difference between a fulmer and a plain cheek is that the fulmer, used without the keeper loops, feels more like a loose ring bit, while a full cheek feels more like an eggbutt. The fulmer doesn't sit as still in the mouth as a full cheek (which my horse likes), and you can see how much it moves by the movements of the cheeks.
Mine is a pretty snug fit - no gap between cheek and corner of the mouth - and it doesn't rub. The only thing I have to be careful of is that the noseband on my combination bridle (i.e. like the noseband on a headcollar, quite loose) sits high enough on his head so the cheeks can't get caught under the noseband. I also would never tie my horse up with the bit on, particularly if there's a haynet around in case he catches the bit on something.

I don't think the fulmer or full cheek bit could help to keep a horse "straight". But both will prevent the bit from sliding through the mouth and will put some pressure on the side of the face which can be helpful for steering with a youngster.

[orangetails]

Re the noseband, why don't you try replacing your padded cavesson with a thin flat hunter style cavesson? It won't have the same bulk under the bit cheeks then - I have used these successfully with this sort of bit (fixed cheek snaffle - technically a fulmer is the loose ring one isn't it, otherwise it is just a 'full cheek'??)

I always use keepers - I think the cheeks are too dangerous to be used without, much more risk of them getting caught on things if they can move around (even simply getting stuck under the noseband which was what happened with mine when I used it without the loops - but it then affects the action of the bit especially as it's usually just one side which gets stuck! and it can't be very comfortable either. I wouldn't have said my nosebands were particularly loose either - although I certainly don't crank them shut, the standard 'two finger' width usually)

[Pony-Nutt]

If you think the bit is quarter an inch too big fit a pair of bit guards, one pair takes up a quarter of an inch and they also stop rubbing. You dont want the metal right up against the sides anyway and bit guards would eliminate that

[lisap]

The purpose of the keepers (or retaining straps) act as a safeguard against the cheek ends getting caught up in a nostril. They also maintain the bits' position.

The long cheek ends prevent the bit sliding through the mouth and also assist the lateral action of turning the young horse by pressing up against the animal's face.

I have used the fulmer with and without the retaining straps, as sometimes it is better to have a 'looser' action of the bit in the mouth rather than a fixed action. It depends on what the individual young horse prefers.

I'd probably not use a cavesson noseband with a fulmer, either no noseband or a dropped noseband. If using a dropped noseband I would not use the retaining straps as the noseband would do the job of maintaining the position of the bit in the mouth.

In my opinion, the keepers sold with fulmers are not usually nearly long enough, and their shortness can mean that the bit is pulled into an inverted V in the horses mouth, making it very uncomfortable - so find the longest keepers available or do without.

[LuckyRed]

fascinating discussion - I use a full cheek without keepers but have been told by many people that I should use them. My main instructor is dead against the keeps as they mess with the bit action and the way it lies in the horses mouth so it's interesting to see the debate above, especially teh comment from Lisap about most keepers being too short - I couldn't get my keepers to attach to the bit without really pulling and changing the postition of the bit, no matter how hard I tried!