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Post by bramblesmum on Dec 10, 2011 10:01:52 GMT 1
I have a 6month old filly she has been well handled using IH approach since she was born and has been a little pleasure, she was picking up her feet lovely and letting me pick them, however after a farrier visit (where he did nothing wrong) she has taken exception and has now refused to let her hind feet be picked up.
Front feet are good still, I can groom all down the leg on hinds but when you get it up she cow kicks until she gets it away and there really is no holding onto it, any suggestions guys?
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Post by ladyndibs on Dec 10, 2011 11:15:09 GMT 1
Have you tried picking them up and putting them straight back down before she has a chance to kick, maybe try that a few times if you can then just hold them for a second or two after a couple of days, she might just have been uncomfortable because of having her foot up so long.
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Post by bramblesmum on Dec 10, 2011 11:26:13 GMT 1
Yes you don't get the chance to get it up before she snatches it away
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Post by specialsparkle3 on Dec 10, 2011 12:45:10 GMT 1
Was it the same farrier she has had all her life ??
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Post by medicinepony on Dec 10, 2011 15:57:58 GMT 1
sounds like she was uncomfrotable having to hold her leg up for so long and at the moment thats all she remembers. if you go right back to the beginning to when you were just teaching her to have her legs touched you will eventually be able to overcome her negative experience
she is still young so if you just take your time she will learn to accept having her feet done again
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Post by bramblesmum on Dec 10, 2011 18:28:27 GMT 1
Yes same farrier SS shes become more opinionated as shes got older, this was the second trim she'd needed before that the farrier had just petted her to make friends when doing the others, hes been since and petted her no issues, just the picking up that she was very unhappy about am grooming and picking her feet out most days just wanted to make sure I was going right way about it in just as soon as she lifts praising, and hoping that she'll get back to picking it up properly soon.
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Post by specialized on Dec 10, 2011 18:34:25 GMT 1
This is a great one for pressure and release, take it in very small stages and release pressure by walking away after each progression. Do not try to lift or hold her foot until she is comfortable with loads of touching and holding the leg. Our farrier is excellent with the babies and gives them so much time so they never get stressed, but he uses pressure and release really well. Does she actually need farrier attention at 6 months, or are you just trying to get her used to it?
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Post by mandal on Dec 10, 2011 18:57:13 GMT 1
Agree with specialized, I call this advance and retreat but it is the same. The hand on a stick is great too. Small steps starting where she is comfortable is important to and be prepared to go back and repeat a few steps if she becomes anxious.
Watch the farrier isn't taking a bit too much off her and making her a little sore though. Toby became very reluctant to have his feet handled twice after trims. I changed farriers both times in the end and the problem resolved.
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Post by suzirock on Dec 10, 2011 21:04:08 GMT 1
The other thing I would suggest is that once you get to the stage of actually holding up a back foot again for a few seconds, then initally just ask her to hold it just off the ground rather than the normal height that is easier for us. Gradually over a few sessions you can lift the foot higher, when you feel she is ok with it all again. My suspicions are that her back legs were possibly held just that little bit too high for a tad too long with the farrier and maybe next time he comes just ask him to let her relax her leg and lower it a bit while he trims her, she will find it a lot easier to hold it lower for longer. Her ligaments and muscles in and around her hip area are very immature and we do underestimate how hard it is for them to hold a back leg up (at any age, let alone 6 months). She is obviously an intelligent little thing to react quite so dramatically to an experience with the farrier (who Im sure is very good at what he does). Hopw that all makes sense
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Post by bramblesmum on Dec 11, 2011 2:51:10 GMT 1
thanks guys does make sense, she has needed the farrier attention as her feet were very long and she was born with the tendons flexed wrongly, thankfully all straight now so less requirement as urgently, shes a very intelligent girl suzi you've got her spot on, shes like it with handling too immediatly has the measure of someone its amusing to watch at times, glad I kept her as I love the ones with a quick mind.
Will take it all slow and steady and will work on the pressure release training for her, shes responded well to it for other things x
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Post by jen1 on Dec 11, 2011 11:40:04 GMT 1
main thing is don't back off, stay at the end your asking to move, and are you holding the hair at all? is the farrier? the easiest way not to be shaken off is to hold the hoof with your arm like a pendulum, and your hand palm side covering the frog, and fingers curled round the toes, if you do it in pairs someone can at least reward her in some way, i like clicker training for this job,
so you can reward the thought and then the smallest action ect,
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pd
Grand Prix Poster
Posts: 1,367
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Post by pd on Dec 11, 2011 20:17:10 GMT 1
Two things jump out at me about this.
1. I like to keep youngsters trimmed as regularly as older horses, just because they're not working, doesn't mean their feet aren't growing. If they get very long (which you describe) you are unbalancing the joints, ligaments and tendons as she grows which is very undesirable. Keep her trimmed every 6-8 weeks at least. A sudden dramatic change of balance may have made her sore and that may be the reason she's unwilling to let anyone do that to her again.
2. In my experience, farriers tend to hike up hind legs quite high on their thigh in order to work on them, if that is the case, then the trick is to hold the leg much lower until she accepts a position she feels comfortable with.
Its all about rebuilding her trust. In handling her you must be consistent, and not scared, keep running your down the leg, without asking for anything until she relaxes, the slowly get to the point where she lifts the leg a little off the floor without panicking. Time, consistency and don't be scared of her, and you'll regain her trust.
Good luck.
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Post by suzirock on Dec 11, 2011 22:20:35 GMT 1
He he! I totally know what you mean, with the 'quick' ones, the rewards when you get it right are so fulfilling, cos they totally put their heart into everything they do....love it ;D
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Post by shan on Dec 11, 2011 23:21:36 GMT 1
Also you could try picking up her feet with a rope or line - keeps you out of harms way, you can give treats easier if you want to reward that way, and you can save your back!
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Post by helenj on Dec 19, 2011 17:13:21 GMT 1
Hi bramblesmum
I have found with babies that not only is the holding high and for a length of time a problem, but also the out to the side, both forwards and back - if you watch where the farrier holds the foot, there can be a lot of rotation through shoulder / hip and she may have some stiffness from being stretched more than she is used to.
Once you have got her back to giving you her legs nicely, work on lateral movements. So, lift the leg forwards, support the fetlock and the hock with each hand, and move the whole leg from the hip in circles clockwise and anti-clockwise, very small and gently to start with, but you can go a bit bigger over a few sessions until you are doing the same range of movement the farrier will ask for. Do the same by lifting the leg backwards, supporting the inside of the hock as it runs up to the thigh and the front of the fetlock. The trick with the movements is not to twist the hock joint - the movement should come from the hip.
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