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Post by Chestnutmare on Jan 5, 2011 14:21:09 GMT 1
I have a welsh and was just wondering what bit i should use on her. I have been using a fullmer snaffle but have no brakes what so ever, i have tried a bosal and still have no brakes, i try using seat bones etc to slow her down but it dosen't seem to help. I don't want a harsh bit or anything...i just want some brakes to feel safe. She doesn't tank off she just dosen't seem to like stopping
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izzy
Grand Prix Poster
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Post by izzy on Jan 5, 2011 14:56:06 GMT 1
How about a three ring french link try on middle ring and lots of transistion work.
I used to ride izzy in one before we went bitless, she hated the single joint of a snaffle much prefered the french link,now when she gets strong i find a long track and do trot canter trot transitions using trees as my markers .I only do about 12 strides of each this works great for me ,i appreciate every horse is different good luck.
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Post by Chestnutmare on Jan 5, 2011 15:09:11 GMT 1
that is the only bit that worked on my old fell pony on the middle ring too. I could try one and see how she goes. Thanks.
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Post by jaxnbreeze on Jan 5, 2011 15:24:36 GMT 1
My horse is half-welsh and has quite a small cramped mouth. Because she hadn't been properly 'broken' she was very resistant in her mouth and braced through her shoulders and neck. She hates snaffles because they put too much pressure on her tongue which is thick where the bit lies but she is fine with a myler pelham. Because her face is quite wide as she is also id xtb we have to use rubber rings to make it fit closer to her mouth. All this has taken and lot of trial and error but the most helpful book I have read is Mike Schaffers 'Right from the Start'. Working from the ground really is the best way with this type of horse. Encouraging her to relax her jaw and subsequently her mind/body is the key to lightness but this has to be done with extreme care as a horse hasn't really any idea what we want it to do. I notice your horse is slightly camped-out in front and my girl was just the same and also her back has become more level - although this conformation is quite typical of Welshies. Good luck chestnutmare I am not an expert but I know from experience that it's not much fun riding a braced little horse but when you can get her to soften she'll be fine. Jax
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vab
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Post by vab on Jan 5, 2011 15:44:31 GMT 1
Some Welshies prefer pelham bits anyway - my girly goes much better in that than a snaffle its because they have a small mouth
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Post by Chestnutmare on Jan 5, 2011 15:56:36 GMT 1
I was wondering if there was a paticular bit that they prefered due to their small mouth, what pelham would i use straight bar or jointed?
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Post by kirsten on Jan 5, 2011 18:42:46 GMT 1
Absolutely agree with jaxnbreeze - am relieved that someone is saying its not the bit but the horse needs schooling, rider needs to work on position etc. Groundwork, groundwork, groundwork! Try reading some Peggy Cummings, and TTOUCH for her posture, to help her relax. Good luck!
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Azrael
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Post by Azrael on Jan 5, 2011 20:23:36 GMT 1
I've got my welsh bratwithnobrakes in a myler bit, mb04 hanging cheek, only thing she's ever had really good brakes in. I've got a mullen mouth pelham for her as well that I use for showing but she's more likely to fight that than the myler which she listens to without arguing. In a plain snaffle I might as well not bother having a bit in for all the obedience I get when she doesn't agree with my suggestion to slow down. Younger welsh brat is going to be trying a kimblewick after deciding to try pulling her loaners arms out when wanting to go faster out hacking Love it that my cobs, that everyone assume will be easy and sensible, need stronger bits than my hyperactive TBxWB who has perfect brakes in a loose ring snaffle lol
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Post by Chestnutmare on Jan 5, 2011 21:17:24 GMT 1
Thats all i have done with her since owing her Groundwork groundwork groundwork, with the odd schooling session riding her. I think welshys are quite bolshy but once you get them where you want them you have cracked it. I lost out on the mb04 hanging cheek bit on ebay last friday got outbit by £1, will see if theres another on. My TB was hyperactive but had keen brakes so know where your coming from
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Post by jes on Jan 5, 2011 21:31:51 GMT 1
My Welsh D goes best in a low ported Kimblewick. I perservered with a snaffle for years and have done plenty of schooling. He goes fine in the school, but out hacking is a different matter. He would just run through the snaffle, which wasn't fun!
I tried a Waterford snaffle for a while, but he hated it.
Then I tried a pelham, which was much better, but I found it too awkward with two reins for hacking (on my spooky, nappy, traffic shy horse!). Then I tried a Kimblewick and wow, what a difference. He loves the bit, he lowers his head and opens his mouth for it. I can ride him with a very light contact and I have control.
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Post by petethebee on Jan 5, 2011 21:55:01 GMT 1
Ground work has to be the answer. Stronger bits and loads of gubbins is not an "ask" to stop it becomes a command! Teach the horse to want to stop. Long lines and a dually used properly have helped our welshies who have had a similar problem. The key is to become lighter in the ask not heavier. I like a horse with a bit of attitude, they're a bit braver when it comes to scary things. Gently gently catchy monkey.
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Post by jes on Jan 5, 2011 22:13:01 GMT 1
For me though PetetheBee, I don't think it was necessarily the fact that it was a stronger bit, it was the right bit for my horse. I have done lots and lots of groundwork and ridden schooling, but none of that helped with the fact that he wasn't comfortable with his bit. He is now and we are both happy because I don't have to use strength and I can be very light with my aids.
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Post by kirsten on Jan 5, 2011 23:24:30 GMT 1
My Welsh x TB (but very much more Welsh) "project" horse came to me after a desperate owner had used successively strong bits, nosebands, as well as a martingale. He was virtually unmanageable. I have spent literally years teaching him to relax his jaw, and not be afraid of his body, etc. Pete is absolutely correct - we need to work on lightness. Mark Rashid does a good DVD on lightness. Just because you have a cob (I currently have three!) does NOT mean it should be assumed she will be strong mouthed/bolshy. I have over the years with previous horses gone down the stronger bit route, etc. If I had known then what I do now I would certainly not have used more/stronger "gadgets." But I was doing the best I could with the knowledge and tools that I had at the time, as I am now. Sorry - I am passionate about getting people to think before whacking more "gubbins" on their horses!
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Azrael
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Post by Azrael on Jan 6, 2011 0:28:53 GMT 1
I agree with it not so much being a stronger bit but one that suits the horse, and the best suited isn't always a snaffle. I don't see the point of sticking to a plain snaffle because it's considered a milder bit if it doesn't suit the horse. I haven't seen anyone on this thread suggesting the strongest bit you can find, tie it's head down and make it listen approach anyway.
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Post by jaxnbreeze on Jan 6, 2011 14:55:28 GMT 1
A snaffle isn't really a mild bit as it has a nut-cracker action and therefore not suitable for a horse with a small mouth, low palate and thick tongue. When I work my horse on the ground I gently ask for halt and then immediatetly drop the reins on her neck as a reward. We try and do this ridden too. It has taken a long time but she is responding to lighter and lighter 'asks' and has stopped bracing and started engaging her brain. She seems to have become more sensitive and intelligent somehow and thinks things through instead of stropping about. I wonder if some of the problem is because cobs were produced to pull carts and not to be ridden as so many of them have an upright shoulder, curved back and therefore generally on the forehand. I like cobs but I think a lot of people have been encouraged to think they are rocking-horse rides when in fact they need a lot of work to get them mentally and physically balanced.
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