Correct timing of leg aids. Discuss.

[wabuska]

Discuss. I know some of you are able to tell exactly where your horses' legs are at all times, but for the rest of us, when is the correct time to apply aids for asking for forward motion and lateral motion (saying moving the quarters over). If I'm waking him up (and despite the fact I know it cancels the energy) I do tend to close both legs on his barrel briskly (no kicks, we're not quite that awful).

I have been happily moving my horse along hacking by meeting his ribcage swinging to my leg, one side after the other when needed. Much of the time he needs no aid at all, but if I need a push on that's it. Now I can't remember why I do things that way?!

Now I find myself moving his quarters over when doing circles with my inside leg on him as his ribcage is moving away, my inside knee is dropping and his inside hind is leaving the ground (that is to get him to step under and across to make a true circle).

Frankly, I find the whole business of the correct leg aid timing quite a challenge. We are increasingly riding off the seat, but I want this leg aid thing nailed.... 30 years since I started and I'm still confused. Sad but true! Hints, tips, experiences. ;D Oh Happy New Year!

[Catrin]

My legs are hopeless if I try to think about them, other than getting them hanging down in the right place. After that, I use my pelvis mostly. As far as teaching lateral movement, I teach it on the ground first, and then try to replicate it when seated on top.

To get go, I breathe in and lift my energy up (I think) and look where I'm aiming for (it took me a long time to realise that when you want to go forwards it's best not to look at the floor.) To change momentum, it's the seatbones: peanuts to water melons, the bigger the movement the more I'm speeding up or slowing down. I do sometimes use the bell clappers, alternating the legs as the horse's belly moves from side to side, more often to maintain momentum, I suppose. It's really weird trying to describe what you do and why, when usually you just do it at the time. So that's walking straight.

Turning, I just rotate my pelvis, not so easy to do a volté on a western saddle as the horn stops the tight turn, but I have managed it with my husband's horse. It's much easier on my Heather Moffett, mind you most things are easier on my horse, though I do learn a lot on my husband's. If, you rotate your pelvis, your legs put pressure on in just the correct place on each side and your hands move just the right amount to support the turn. If I want a lateral movement, I just add a bit more pressure with the leg I want to move away from and support with the rein as I probably want the shoulders to move sideways, not round the corner like in a turn. (There are probably words like indirect rein and outside leg that I should be using, but if I tried to, I'd probably get it wrong.)

Upward transitions, are a bit like 'go,' except preceded by a big out breath - I really haven't got the hang of half–halt. I seem to get the first half of half–halt and my horse knows what comes next as he always feels as though his back comes up and his front end is very light. Really, I suppose that unless I know what I want to do with a leg aid, I am likely to get the timing really late, so I do something else instead and my legs join in just in time.

I deliberately use leg pressure when I want to turn on the haunches or forehand, or do a half or full pass. As it's something we've done on the ground, just a nudge in the right place will get the movement I want going and the reins or opposite leg stop the travel from being where I don't want to go.

The one I can't do very well is the slowing down. I have been known to canter round and round until my brain can get my bum to stop. I have to really give a big out breath and drop my weight into my thighs to shift down the gears. Fortunately my horse is very patient and lets me work it all out before he says, "Mum, can we do something else now?"

I suppose to know where his legs are I rely on my seatbones again. If I synchronise their movement with the walk, trot or canter of his back legs, I can work out where the front ones are. As my seatbones attempt the water melon walk, they are matching the leg positions on each side. When he trots, the seatbone tells me to rise as the back leg has come under so the opposite foreleg will be on the ground. Canter transition is the only one where I think of my legs not my seatbones. I consciously move my inside leg forwards and lower outside leg back a little, but have my pelvis facing where I'm going and we get canter. (In other words, doing the cantering round the kitchen thing.)

I rely on my Centred Riding Instructor to know what my legs are supposed to be doing and fortunately she does. I try to remember, but really don't recollect all the detail, just the feeling that I want. I do know that she has surprised me by making me realise that you can get a lot of effect by doing very little as long as you breathe and sit right and have a positive idea of what you want. Of course there is also the fact that I can't do a lot yet —I have grand aspirations which are far beyond my capabilities — but watch this space.

PS don't worry about the thirty years, I'd been muddling along for over sixty without a clue. Now I think I'm making progress - you're never too late to improve, it seems.

[heather]

Hi Kanga,

In walk, legs close and release with the swing of the belly - ie when belly swings to right, left leg closes, and releases again ( but without pinging off) as the belly swings back to the left, and vice versa.

In trot, close both legs on the first beat, release on second, so that the aid is a 'pulsing' of the calf muscle, never clamped which will restrict the swing of the belly and therefore the reach under of the hindleg.

In canter, close both legs on first beat ( count to yourself, one two three, if needed) and release for beats two and three, close again. Ultimately, with a highly trained horse which is truly in front of the leg, the leg aids will be less still and only applied if the horse loses impulsion.

Never kick as this will cause the horse to board up his ribcage and prevent his back from swinging, and therefore, stops, rather than encourages, forward movement!

Use a whip on your boot to make a noise, as you close your leg, as it is far more effective at galvanising a less than lively horse, than kicking!- and also a lot kinder!

The correct use of the leg is imperative- an inwards and slightly forwards, brush/nudge of the calf muscle, never backwards with heel drawn up.

Hope this helps. I do explain the use of the leg in one of my youtube clips with the Equisimulator, cant remember which one, so you would have to watch all four!

www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6PTs1XPAug

www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMBdR2yrEOs

www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WfEjdk0gKs

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fbbm_U9MdPc

Heather

[Catrin]

Jan 1, 2010 11:05:30 GMT 1 heather said:

...
The correct use of the leg is imperative- an inwards and slightly forwards, brush/nudge of the calf muscle, never backwards with heel drawn up. ...

I wonder if I've ever done that! I knew I didn't know what I was talking about - you always get that feeling don't you!

I have copied Heather's post, now I'm going to print it out and stick it on a cupboard till I've learned it.

[heather]

Hi Catrin,

Confess I am not a big fan of all this heavy breathing . I find it can cause the rider to think too much about the breathing, and miss the timing of the aids! Also prolonged breathing out tends to make the seat heavier, and I am always striving for a light but always adhesive seat, to make it easier for my horse to carry me.

Think about it, the horse is trying to lift his back at each stride. My aim is to keep the seat light in order that the back can lift.

To feel which hindleg is coming under or shoulder coming back, this is when your seatbone is lowered. As the hindleg strikes the ground, it pushes the back up under your seatbone and lifts it up and forward, pushing the horse's shoulder forwards at the same time.

So keep it simple! Seatbone down and back = hindleg drawing under, seatbone up and forwards= hindleg thrusting in contact with the ground, and shoulder also swinging forwards.

This of course, also equates with the correct diagonal in rising trot. When you feel, so on the right rein, your left seatbone lower, this is the sit phase, and when it is pushed up and forwards, it is the rise phase. So seatbone down, bum down, seatbone up, bum out of saddle- simple, eh?

Canter strike off, correct lead, say, right lead again, you will feel the right side of the horse rise, as the forehand rises to lift the inside shoulder up and forwards. If you feel the left side rising, wrong leg!!

In downwards transitions, providing the horse is on the bit, closing your seat muscles and upper thighs, will effect the downward transition. Lower legs also lightly close to keep the hindlegs engaged, and fingers may need to close on the rein, but no backward traction. For a canter to walk transition, for instance, a strong, sharp closing of seat and upper thigh, is needed, but this is graduated so that for instance, a trot walk transition, would need only a light closing. Pick up the swing of the belly with your legs immediately, to ensure a smooth forwards downwards transition, even to halt!

Ultimately, there will be no need to do more than close the seat and lower leg. Yes, some riders do hold their breath, but as few seem to expire from actual lack of oxygen, try this, without thinking about your breathing!! ;D

Heather

[wabuska]

Thank you so much Catrin and Heather... yes, pasted (on forehead facing eyes if needs be)...XX I think the only element where I can say, yes, we're there are smooth downward transitions with that pinch of the seat and upper thigh. Off to Youtube!

[Catrin]

Jan 1, 2010 12:10:13 GMT 1 heather said:

Hi Catrin,

Confess I am not a big fan of all this heavy breathing . I find it can cause the rider to think too much about the breathing, and miss the timing of the aids! Also prolonged breathing out tends to make the seat heavier, and I am always striving for a light but always adhesive seat, to make it easier for my horse to carry me.

Think about it, the horse is trying to lift his back at each stride. My aim is to keep the seat light in order that the back can lift. ...

Now that is very interesting. As I had the lung function of an 87 year old on my last spirometry test, I have had huge problems opening my chest cavity and stopping my horse and couldn't maintain a canter without getting out of breath. Hence the bizarre experience a few lessons back when I was trying to do a half halt to slow my trot. I got a beautiful canter instead! That continued for two circuits of the school, two 20m circles, two 10m circles and finally I disengaged the hind quarters with the help of an obstacle and stopped. Admittedly I had brain failure early on or I'd have changed the rein onto the 'stiff' one. However, I did realise that by focussing on my breathing rather than anything else to slow or stop my horse, I had cantered further than I had for years and not got out of breath.

Since then, I have been practising opening my chest cavity, with the help of the osteopath, who has been watching the resultant DVD of my riding and noticed that immediately after the out breath, my shoulders relax and Freyr's back softens and comes up.

My next lesson will be post ice and snow, but hopefully before then I can practise moving my emphasis from breathing and cantering simultaneoulsly, to using leg aids. I have now added your comments to the earlier ones and got two sheets on the cupboard door.

... Seatbone down and back = hindleg drawing under, seatbone up and forwards= hindleg thrusting in contact with the ground, and shoulder also swinging forwards.

This of course, also equates with the correct diagonal in rising trot. When you feel, so on the right rein, your left seatbone lower, this is the sit phase, and when it is pushed up and forwards, it is the rise phase. So seatbone down, bum down, seatbone up, bum out of saddle- simple, eh?

Seatbone awareness was the most useful thing I learned this year. For years I could always rise correctly on one rein, but not the other, so had to look at the foreleg, bounce and rise to 'correct' the 'feel'. Now I just feel for the seatbone coming up and rise, it seems so simple, but if no one ever told you to think where your seatbones are, it's not. The other thing is sitting trot, just moving my seatbones in a figure of eight, makes me feel like I'm glued to the saddle. Mind you, it's easier to do in my Heather Moffett saddle than it was in my Faringdon! By the way, my osteopath keeps saying she is always amazed at my excellent leg position. I told her how to get the same excellent leg position on her horse.

I may be a very later starter at learning to ride, but I am amazed how much I have improved this year and my 21 year old horse feels so much lighter too.

Even OAPs can do it when they get the right help and advice, oh and saddle. Many thanks for yours.

[june]

One of the most useful things I remember someone saying was that you can only influence a leg when it is in the air. Obviously, the leg on the ground is fixed. So, as Heather says, timing of the leg aids is crucial. If you get the timing right lateral work becomes much easier.

Fortunately it is pretty intuitive. The barrel has to swing out of the way to allow the hind leg to step through, so all you have to do is think about asking the barrel to swing a little further in the direction you want to go and your timing will be correct for asking that leg to step through when it is in the air.

[heather]

Catrin, in your case, you are using breathing techniques for a specific aerobic reason too, so I can see this is necessary . I just think that for many riders, to give them more to think about slows the timing of the aids, which can be split second when you get to higher levels.

Heather

[Deleted]

Very interesting videos Heather, thank you for posting

[feemac]

Heather

Loved the video's can't wait til you come up to aberdeen at the end of the month! Simple when its explained.

Feemac