Azrael
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Post by Azrael on Jan 1, 2008 20:48:24 GMT 1
I'm guessing the FRC also think that shoes are beneficial to the welfare of the horse so not convinced that it being beneficial to welfare will stop them! Even though it doesn't involve nails it is similar to a shoe in that the foot is going to be stuck with how it was trimmed for a few weeks with no wear so it is maybe something that could be seen as something that should only be applied by qualified people. Though considering the number of people in this area shoeing happily without being reg it wouldn't surprise me too much if they didn't bother doing anything!
It looks really useful as a halfway thing for horses coming out of shoes with weak feet and far less faff than boots and pads, but I'm not at all convinced i'm going to be spending my money on using it on sound horses..
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pip
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Post by pip on Jan 1, 2008 21:37:16 GMT 1
Thanks Chrissie - I think we have had similar experiences with our horses, re the Simple System feeds, etc.
It could well be the feed. I can't get Bailey Lo Cal from my feed merchant, which would be my preferred feed, and I wonder if the D & H is the right thing. I have also started to soak the sugarbeet and throw away the water, which is very slightly sweet. I have also reduced his hay tonight!
Thank you for the link to the Silver Lining, I will see what they say.
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Post by chrissiew on Jan 1, 2008 21:44:43 GMT 1
I may be wrong Pip but I "think" dredging my memory somewhere that the D&H Ultimate Balancer is high in starch or sugar or both - can't quite remember, but may be worth checking. Minnie was fine on the Lo Cal which I switched to initially after Top Spec - mainly because I have always fed her a balancer, but to be honest she has got on really well with the Benevit which is cheaper - I just feed her some conditioning cubes or spillers sports cubes on top occasionally depending on whether she needs a bit more energy or condition. (Weirdly she is fine on Top Spec cool and condition cubes, just not the balancer)
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Post by chrissiew on Jan 1, 2008 21:50:11 GMT 1
Not sure that is what it is aimed at Melanie anyway. My understanding is that it is being aimed at a replacement for boots for horses that aren't ready to cope barefoot, not for use on horses that are perfectly fine barefoot. I'd love to think there was a suitable alternative to boots for my mare when wear is exceeding growth which is a problem we have had in the past (although hopefully with our new quicker growing feet maybe not such a problem now - not sure yet, as she is off with a ligament issue at present). I think it would be VERY small minded of the FRC to create over this product. It saddens me that something that could possibly be of such benefit to horses (if it works), could well just become a political brick bat between all the warring factions
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Post by june on Jan 1, 2008 21:54:59 GMT 1
It does wear though Melanie. That's why it only lasts 3 weeks. It wears in the same pattern as the bare foot would wear.
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Azrael
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Post by Azrael on Jan 1, 2008 22:05:54 GMT 1
But the hoof underneath the 'stuff' doesn't wear does it? Pretty much like a shoe, the shoe wears but protects the foot from wear.
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Post by june on Jan 1, 2008 22:13:42 GMT 1
I haven't seen it used in anger yet but from my understanding it does wear through to the hoof, at least in places.
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Post by jen1 on Jan 1, 2008 22:40:09 GMT 1
pip if its any help we started soaking sugar beet in an old pillow case and running water over it for a few hours to rid any colour /suagrs from it, getting them to eat it though took an age,
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Post by june on Jan 1, 2008 23:00:29 GMT 1
chrissiew, Top Spec Cool and Condition cubes are soya and linseed and don't contain the proteins, vitamins and minerals in the balancer so that would be why they are fine for your horse whereas the balancer wasn't. They are designed to be fed alongside the balancer which already has the full complement of vits and mins so there aren't any added to the Cool and Condition.
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Azrael
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Post by Azrael on Jan 1, 2008 23:05:32 GMT 1
The only non-vague thing about wear I've found is that they wear through at the toe in about three weeks and should be replaced at that point and the foot trimmed, so any wear to the foot is when the perfect hoof wear has worn through and is due to be replaced. But it does seem that it wears in a similar way to hoof horn so is different from a shoe in that way.. Maybe the FRC could be convinced its just a fancy bandage ;D Just found the £40ish pounds it costs is for 4 feet, which isn't too bad really, but would get quite expensive including cost of that + trim and application. I found something about a discount for perfect hoof club members, which is free to join! The stuff available now isn't suitable for working on tarmac but seems something else that will be is being developed.. Looks like interesting stuff, but still not convinced enough to part with money The stuff I've found on KC's website claims it improved all feet its been tried on so looks like they are marketing it for all horses not just the ones with horrible feet... its even possible to jump in it which I'm hoping noone is planning to do straight out of shoes with really nasty feet...
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Post by taklishim on Jan 1, 2008 23:16:59 GMT 1
I had your problem Pip and the only solution was to get him off the grass. He has now been off grass for 20 months and is great. My horse was a bit like Sarah B's in her posting and had a diet problem. I tried shoes but they just masked the problems so I accepted he would work fully booted and I would have to make it work.
haven't looked at KC's site yet for the wrap but I think boots are always going to be needed for LGL horses in spring and autumn for situations where people cannot or don't want to get their horses off grass. I don't think, from my understanding of the reading about the easyboot edge, that the sole tread is going to be any different. I thought it was currently on a bare tread pattern.
I am using epics with buckle ups on all four feet and dremeling the soles. The boots go on and off very easily and they are great. I always wanted the renegades but as I don't have a trimmer that was never going to happen so I made the best of the easyboots and I am not sure now that I would change even if I had the chance.
I am not having many problems with slipping on mud. The knack is to teach the horse to slip so that he knows how to deal with the situation.
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Post by june on Jan 1, 2008 23:36:59 GMT 1
I think the idea is that the KC wrap provides pressure to the hoof wall as well as the sole and since pressure stimulates growth you get a stronger foot fairly quickly. Certainly the photo he shows of a badly chipped foot with a toe crack before the wrap and two weeks later suggests it does stimulate hoof wall growth quite impressively. It is actually derived from a wound care product that has been used for years so it could be called a bandage I guess!
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Post by Susan on Jan 2, 2008 0:12:28 GMT 1
[/quote]
Yes it is, by UK standards it is a shoe so no-one except a farrier will be permitted to fit this product over here.[/quote]
I do not agree personally,from what I see and have heard it is a wrap of bandage not unlike vet wrap, so if that was the case Just well, all owners would be in a very sad position applying poultices or even boots!
We are not preparing a foot for a shoe or indeed applying a shoe in any shape or form.. as June has pointed out it is only a conditioning product. I could also be in a problem by sticking on pads then to hack out.. I think the FRC have many more issues to be concerned about.. like the serious shortage of farriers and so few taking up the trade..
Yann I think the approx 40.00 is for 4 feet I believe and it isn't looked on as a permanent answer but a way to get a foot more adapted by the strengthening it does to the whole 7 foot structures. So someone like me would use it only on fronts and max 3 weeks use is because it stimulates growth so well the foot will need a trim and re-stock how is it doing.. I dont see it only for crocks..I see it as help to Flynn and many horses like him who certainly isnt a crock but in need of further help. But then that is because I dont think I will ever accept I have the best foot..it can improve even more..
KC has been trialling this a long time.. any product that aids foot conditioning and helping it work without a shoe has to be the best thing ever, and perhaps we should be pleased it is about to be available for us to use.
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Azrael
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Post by Azrael on Jan 2, 2008 0:33:14 GMT 1
Poultices, boots and taped on pads aren't left on for 3 weeks at a time Hopefully it will be seen as a bandage more than a shoe because it looks rather useful, but given the FRC thought a bit about whether boots counted as a shoe a few years ago it might just be too good an opportunity for those that don't like barefoot very much..
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Post by justinej on Jan 2, 2008 11:21:31 GMT 1
Poultices, boots and taped on pads aren't left on for 3 weeks at a time Hopefully it will be seen as a bandage more than a shoe because it looks rather useful, but given the FRC thought a bit about whether boots counted as a shoe a few years ago it might just be too good an opportunity for those that don't like barefoot very much.. It's not that people don't like barefoot (the FRC is being incredibly supportive of the UKNHCP and the EPAUK), it's that there has to be a line drawn somewhere and considering the legal system in the UK, put simply anything fixed to the foot is considered the farriers domain and anything removable is a boot. I don't personally see why, if this product is any good and is worthwhile, it cannot be marketed to farriers? If KC bought out a shoe, that's what he would have to do in the UK anyway wouldn't he? The one thing that concerns me about the product at the moment is that it cannot be used on tarmac which is the only use I would have for it.
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