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Post by couerdelion on Jan 11, 2012 17:28:26 GMT 1
I have bred a lovely filly foal who is kind and willing to learn, 8 months old, weaned. Easy to catch, groom, superb with farrier.
My problem is leading, she will set off happily and then plant herself until someone gives her a push from behind. I am using a normal leather headcollar and have not got into a pulling match with her. She was fine whilst I could reach behind her with my arm but once she was too big for me to reach she started stopping. There is no stress or fighting/ears back etc, just a stop and then walk on after a few seconds or minutes or a shove. I have been very careful to avoid any running back, which she has not offered since being very young.
I am thinking of using a dually but I am unsure how it would help the filly to walk on. Would a be nice rope halter be better as it gives poll pressure, but I have never used either and do not want to make mistakes. Over to you please.
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Post by BJMM on Jan 11, 2012 17:56:52 GMT 1
When I taught my home bred filly to lead, I used a 22ft lead rope, I lead her on my right, passed the rope along her off side, round her quarters and into my left hand. Then if she planted, just a small amount of pressure on the rope was enough to get her moving again. I found that this followed on well from using my arm behind her.
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Post by specialized on Jan 11, 2012 18:15:13 GMT 1
I know it's a bit late now, but we taught ours to lead with their mothers from birth as they were stabled. We led the mare and foal together, one on the left and one on the right and alternated sides - never had a problem since.
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Post by jill on Jan 11, 2012 18:23:07 GMT 1
Teach her, with pressure and release. Make it a specific lesson rather than learning on the hoof so to speak, and be conscientious about giving a release, to begin with for even thinking forward. She'll soon get the hang of it and it comes in so usefull in all sorts of ways - tying up when she is older for one.
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Amanda Seater
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Post by Amanda Seater on Jan 11, 2012 18:55:03 GMT 1
I lead one of mine with the mare. It stuck for one and not the other.
With one who similarly to yours planted. I decide to put a touch on the lead rope( not pull and not great pressure) and then gave a treat for forward movement. One session done and leads well with no treats. She just didn't get that she should move forwards and when she did for treat she realised.
I would rather not use closing halters on a foal, they are too fragile if they do get in a tizz and will remember.
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Post by happysnail on Jan 11, 2012 19:18:21 GMT 1
Work using pressure-release. Forwards is the most difficult direction so practice in a circle, then practice step wise diagonally using angles rather than asking forward. Monty has a section in "From My Hands" to yours and explains how you can use a figure of eight rope (around quarters and chest), graduation to leading in a headcollar and lead rope. Sarah Weston's "No Fear, No Force" is marvellous not just for wild foals but setting up training and management for handling that is sympathetic and successful. If you get to go on the IH course "Foal Handling" you'll get lovely hands on experience too. It's nice to mix training with quality bonding time. Picture attached is my filly foal leading for the first time. She had a walk with mum and lots of time hanging out scratching. Very relaxed and laid back experience. Attachments:
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sazjayp
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Post by sazjayp on Jan 11, 2012 19:18:46 GMT 1
I had this problem with my chap and as I had no help at the time, I had to resort to tying a plastic bag to the end of a long garden cane...if he stopped, I'd put the garden cane behind me and shake...I didn't care which direction we went in (normally sideways) it was just to unstick his feet. It worked a treat.
Don't use a dually on horses under 1 year old - the bones in their face are still soft and it can cause issues (according to 2 RA's who I spoke to when I was having this problem)
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varkie
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Post by varkie on Jan 11, 2012 19:39:49 GMT 1
Definitely no dually or any other kind of pressure halter or thin rope halter. At this age you really dont' want to put much pressure on their head.
The stopping and rooting is fairly common at this age. Usually it can be overcome by something as simple as zigzagging them - if they won't go forwards, ask for a sideways/diagonal step. Once you get their feet unfrozen, they'll usually go forwards. If they're really sticky, you just keep asking for alternate side steps. A few sessions like that, and they usually learn to walk nicely.
If that doesn't work - as someone else has said, I'd attach a second lead rope (not the one you're leading from) and run it behind foalie - when foalie stops, you then have an ability to ask them to go forwards from behind. You need to be careful about this one tho - if foalie isn't used to things around the sides or backend, or is a bit upwards thinking (i.e. likes to stand on back legs), then this isn't necessarily the ideal method for them.
I'm wary of titbitting foals to teach leading - it can make them nippy. Equally I'd be wary of using a plastic bag on a stick - personally I want to teach my youngsters not to react to plastic bags rustling, not teach them that they're scary and they must move away from them.
Question I'd also ask is whether foalie is testing boundaries, or doesn't understand what you're asking? The things I've listed above are great for a foalie testing boundaries, but for a foalie that genuinely doesn't understand, you need to go back to the drawing board and teach foalie what you're after - and the techniques in Sarah's book are great for that.
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Post by marianne on Jan 11, 2012 19:55:40 GMT 1
With Varkie on this .... zig-zagging. It may be a slow process at the beginning, but you unbalance by asking for sideways, then release the pressure immediately. Repeat on other side etc ...
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Post by antares on Jan 11, 2012 20:24:25 GMT 1
yep, another vote here for zig-zagging! worked with my boy
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Post by Lulu on Jan 11, 2012 20:41:37 GMT 1
Zig-zag always works... You can't unstick a foal moving forward, so you move to the side, and they have to move one foot. I have been known to walk a foal who kept stopping, one step to side, they'd stick, then one step to the other side, they'd move, etc etc. Lots of praise when they get it right. I would not want them frightened by a bag on a stick. I do work with BIG foals (drafts) so they are quite strong and sturdy by 8months old ! We handle them from birth so it makes things easier too.
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Amanda Seater
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Post by Amanda Seater on Jan 11, 2012 21:24:06 GMT 1
a one off well timed treat is not going to teach a foal to nip! I only had to ask once no repeated side to side. Non of my horses nip - they also know not to mug - they do get treats form time to time for doing the right thing. I do use clicker training with my stallion for new or tricky things and then stop. He doesn't mug or nip either.
Not that I do but you can clicker train foals. You could train to a target and they follow the target.
With the side to side thing it is possible to do some hauling I should think especially if the foal is getting large. I am not saying any one does but.....
The question would be is how much pressure are you putting on and how much pressure to unbalance the foal sideways.
this is just something we should all ask ourselves when training a horse but particularly so with a foal.
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izzy
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Post by izzy on Jan 12, 2012 0:15:51 GMT 1
This is very interesting as my 7 month mini does the same then gets excited and has a little wobbly which is highly amusing :-)
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Post by couerdelion on Jan 12, 2012 9:31:27 GMT 1
Thanks to everyone, a lot of sense being talked. Baby just walked in and out of yard no problems at all, might be different this evening though !
I don't feel she is testing boundaries yet because she has been so willing in all other issues. She already steps back off the door and gates with a simple spoken 'step back' and she puts her feet in my hand again with a spoken word and gentle touch. It's almost as if she stops has a look round and then goes again, I don't as yet, feel she is actually saying 'no - make me, it's more of a let me look at the cows, chickens etc etc.
I will do some specific leading lesson with her rather than just in and out of yard and keep you all posted on my progress. She is a big girl RIDxIrish Cob and she is hopefully a HOYS Maxi Cob in the making. Thanks again
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Post by jen1 on Jan 12, 2012 11:10:30 GMT 1
i first taught mine to accept me and my hands all over them , then did it with a wide long fleece scarf, made into a figure of 8, one loop around the bum and another round the with area of the neck, and i used a halter too, with a very short piece of leather so they felt the odd bit of pressure on there head , and gentle pressure and release, very good lesson to teach them because when it comes to tying up they understand pressure and release
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