anon
Grand Prix Poster
Posts: 1,014
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Post by anon on Dec 13, 2005 10:14:10 GMT 1
good grief!
"NO way would I ever go that close to the back end" - why not? teach the horse that you are safe - and then HE will become safe to handle!
"mine wouldn't dare kick me now " - so you have taught your horse to fear you - and rely on fear to stop it kicking you?
"I still wont go near his behind if hes tied on the yard" - !!!!
"as he will kick any other horses coming too close" - sounds like a very fearfiul horse
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Post by gem on Dec 13, 2005 10:30:53 GMT 1
As an example I was handling a horse that had been on box rest, I didnt know him and he was being very badly behved and wouldnt stand still, I opted for the front end as I was unsure about the back end and he reared up and caught my hand with his front hoof while lashing out. I now have a shattered knuckle that looks unsightly and three years on can still hurt, the back end is my safer tack now yes they may kick but they cant get as much power into it if you are close and they know you are there.
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Post by kas on Dec 13, 2005 11:05:15 GMT 1
Most people who give the hind end a wide berth when changing sides don't leave enough space to be safe anyway. If the horse kicked out they would get hurt much more badly than if they were in close. Being as comfortable being handled around the back and front is just as much a part of my horses' basic education as it is to be handled from the side. You're never safe with a horse that really wants to kick you. I know a lady who is having terrible trouble with a big mare that kicks forward with the hind legs to get her, when she's stood by her head putting a headcollar on for example. Obviously you have to be more careful with strange horses, but if everyone put in some decent basic education with their horses we'd all be a lot safer.
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Post by lucitania on Dec 13, 2005 11:19:18 GMT 1
I duck under the leadrope or walk behind out of the kicking range. I was taught as a kid that when you brush and groom the tail, you should not stand behind the horse but to the side, and this what I have always done. At the riding school everyone stands directly behind the horses, within inches of the horse's bum! I personally would not feel safe doing that- never mind saying that your horse never kicks, but howabout when he is only fending off that fly near his back end with a sharp kick, and your kneecap just happens to be in the way...However, how do you manage to do plaitting etc. on the tail if you don't stand directly behind?
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Post by Francis Burton on Dec 13, 2005 11:21:28 GMT 1
Francis is conscipuous by his absence in starting it though. Hey, I've only just come back! I don't spend all my time on horsey discussion boards ya know! Thanks to everyone for replying - I still have two more pages to read. So far though, I think all comments have been very sensible!
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Post by Francis Burton on Dec 13, 2005 11:23:53 GMT 1
I work with lots of unknown horses and some of them do kick out, some with all fours. Wow! Presumably not all four at the same time though?
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Post by gem on Dec 13, 2005 11:25:42 GMT 1
lol I'd pay to see it though
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Post by kas on Dec 13, 2005 11:27:36 GMT 1
LOL Francis! How do you manage plaiting? Well, that's the whole point of desensitising your whole horse, you just try to make things as safe as possible. You increase the odds in your favour. It doesn't always work, I got "chinned" by Joe once when he raised his knee to get rid of a fly (I was combing his feathers), boy did I see stars! However, with horses as in all of life, sometimes "nuts" Happens.
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Post by kas on Dec 13, 2005 11:28:12 GMT 1
Ooop! Bad KAS! I didn't say nuts happens - I said S**t Happens ;D
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Post by Francis Burton on Dec 13, 2005 11:36:29 GMT 1
And I don't think anyone should evr even fully trust their own horse either, mine wouldn't dare kick me now but I still wont go near his behind if hes tied on the yard, as he will kick any other horses coming to close. For this reason when being groomed etc hes tied in his stable. Oh dear, that is so sad! Of course you're entitled to your views which are no doubt honestly based in experience. FWIW, there are several horses I would fully trust not to kick me deliberately. So far that trust has been repaid. For these horses, it's not a matter of not daring to kick me. I'd hate a relationship with any horse to be based on fear of consequences. No - I want a horse not to kick me because he likes me, doesn't see me a threat and therefore has no reason to kick me. If that wasn't the case, then I would consider there to be something wrong with the relationship which needs to be worked on!
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Post by Francis Burton on Dec 13, 2005 11:47:08 GMT 1
How do you manage plaiting? Well, that's the whole point of desensitising your whole horse, you just try to make things as safe as possible. You increase the odds in your favour. Don't do a lot of plaiting to be honest! But I take your point, and yes, accidents can easily happen, just as you describe. I am heartened to hear that BHS teaching aims to develop awareness. This surely is the biggest single factor in safety around horses which applies to all activities, not just grooming a tied-up horse in a stable. (P.S. Nuts does happen too - like when I was squeezing through a tensile steel fence, under the electrified strand. Double whammy. LOL!)
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Post by marywelsh on Dec 13, 2005 11:59:17 GMT 1
my horse is a known kicker his back leg will fly out, but this is only when eating his bucket feed and this is only because he was half starved, i do go round the back of him as he has no malice towards humans, but i wouldn,t while he was eating his feed, one of the girls on the yard is convinced he is nasty and will bite and kick out at humans (which he has never done), we have worked on this, keeping his feed times as quiet and away from everyone, and two yrs on i am proud to say that when the aromatherapist came out to give him a massage she said she had never seen a horse so accepting to touch all over his body, but if he gets stressed his back leg does come up but i have never felt under threat
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lovelylace
Grand Prix Poster
Always remember to ride with your soul, not your hands.
Posts: 4,541
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Post by lovelylace on Dec 13, 2005 12:05:35 GMT 1
I am another person who prefers going round close behind rather than in front, or give them a wide berth... I know that some horses might kick out, but mine never have and once an unknown horse did, but luckily I was quite close and he just couldn't get his momentum up so I wasen't hurt.. but I also am person whoi is very aware of the horses body language and will treat every situation on its own merit.
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Post by Spirit of Wales on Dec 13, 2005 12:06:01 GMT 1
I don't know what the BHS teach, but personally I think it should be your own preverance to safety as all horses are individual. My colt gets fidgety when tethered and kicks out with his front legs and he also has a tendancy to nip when you least expect it, so personally I prefer to keep a hand on his rear and walk behind at a safe distance, whilst talking too him.
Lincslass
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Post by Val (Toons&co) on Dec 13, 2005 12:19:22 GMT 1
That's interesting marywelsh. One of the 'kicking' mares at the yard is the same. Will mainly kick when there's food around (but then who in their right mind crosses a field with a feed bucket that is meant for the horse in the next field?) or when stressed - if you turn her out and while you take the headcollar off she just throws one leg repititively LOL.
Mind you Toons kicks at his wall (towards horse in next-door stable) when being fed but he won't if I'm there (if he knows I am of course). I can and do trust my 3 completely. I could get kicked (and have been squashed) if I was caught in the middle of a fight but I know it wouldn't be aimed at me. The only thing I can't do without expecting a cow kick is clean Toons' sheath.
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