|
Post by squidgybaby on Nov 17, 2014 14:21:56 GMT 1
Hi All,
My horse has decided that she won't load in the horsebox on the way home from where ever we have been. There's no fighting, backing up, running from the box, rearing, stressing in any way. She gets to the bottom of the ramp and stops. If I wait she gets in eventually but the waiting is getting longer and longer.
If anyone has any tips other than 'give her a good hiding as she's just being bloody minded' I would be very grateful.
Has anyone else had this kind of issue, am I being silly in thinking that she just doesn't like that box?
Many thanks
|
|
|
Post by lesleyking1 on Nov 17, 2014 19:30:08 GMT 1
If she is being bloody minded then she has every right to be, bless her, it would be so much easier if they could talk.
I would advise you get an RA in, you could try various things first but I found my loading session with my RA fascinating and worth every penny.
|
|
|
Post by squidgybaby on Nov 17, 2014 19:56:55 GMT 1
Unfortunately I don't live near any RA's and I couldn't afford to fly one in so I would love to hear of anyone's experiences about this kind of thing. Both myself and my husband have completed the first level IH courses earlier in the year so I understand the techniques and the use of the Dually. I'm just not sure where to go with a horse that offers no other behaviour than to stand at the bottom of the ramp
|
|
|
Post by alonerawnut on Nov 17, 2014 20:06:57 GMT 1
You could either make standing at the bottom of the ramp 'hard work' vs walking in or try rewarding forward movement: perhaps clicker training? If she plants at the bottom of the ramp, you could back her up and walk in some tight circles before arriving at the bottom of the ramp again: keep everything very calm and business-like. If you get another plant, do the same again. Any hint of forward movement towards the ramp / a foot on the base of the ramp gets a lovely reward: a rub or just a relax and no pressure. Have you tried clicker training? You could reward forward movement with a click and a treat. I know that Sarah Weston uses it very successfully: building up to a single click meaning 'you're doing the right thing, carry on' with a final three clicks and a treat, so you don't end up treating every single step. If she isn't scared or worried about the horsebox but just doesn't see the point in going back in it for the journey home, this might make it all more positive for her. It might be worth getting someone to video your next attempt: one of the RA's might be able to review it and give you some pointers, or just share it with us
|
|
|
Post by Garry on Nov 17, 2014 21:25:25 GMT 1
Can be difficult giving anything other than general advice via a forum. You could take a look at the video in the link which may give you something to work on. www.youtube.com/watch?v=TU6L9uz3ktgWork on getting her easy to move about and understanding how to yield to any pressure that you apply via the lead line (away from the box initially). When at the box don't concentrate on 'loading' her as such, simply work on asking her to move her feet. This may be forwards, backwards or sideways. When asking her forwards don't keep the pressure on, but rather ask and release and give her a few seconds to process what you have asked.
|
|
|
Post by squidgybaby on Nov 17, 2014 21:46:44 GMT 1
Garry, how do I respond if she's planted her feet at the bottom of the ramp. I can get her to move round and back up quite easily away from the box but she locks up at the last stride before she has to put her feet on the ramp. When she's at the ramp I've been unlocking her by moving her left and right but I'm struggling to get her to move forwards. She almost gets a glazed look on her face and stands resting a hind leg - it's the best standing still ever lol. The only behaviour she offers is standing, so I'm finding it hard to know how to react to that as she's not offering much for me to correct - I'm getting a little concerned that I'm actually teaching her not to load although at the moment she's going in with patience and no pressure however there will come a time I will need her go load in my time and not the hours that it's taking ha ha Thanks for the replies so far
|
|
|
Post by SarahW on Nov 18, 2014 12:32:01 GMT 1
Ah, don't be fooled by an apparently resting hind foot - it's actually a running foot and a sign that your horse is ambivalent about loading/ travelling. I would echo what everyone esle has said but suggest you make sure that the back feet are moving. It's so easy to get into a 'Strictly Come Dancing' routine with the front feet only. I now combine IH with a bit of clicker to load horses and find that it's really good for undermining any patterns - so as well as a release of the line if the horse comes forward following a gentle ask forward, I give the horse a click (tongue cluck) and a treat. I also make sure there's a really interesting feed ready in the front of the transport.
|
|
|
Post by Garry on Nov 19, 2014 20:03:26 GMT 1
I'm guessing from what you say in your initial post that she loads OK at home? And it is when you are out somewhere, wanting to load to come home that she is tricky?
As part of her training, load her up at home and take her just a short distance to another yard/farm/space, unload her give her a walk round and then load her up again, several times, before coming home again. Repeat this exercise to several different places, you could also go for a short ride whilst out. So what you are doing is training each element of the travelling experience.
As far as her planting at the bottom of the ramp goes, what Sarah has said is good, especially the food, from a bucket or scoop, as a reward once she is in. You could also try repeatedly asking and releasing as often they will move on the release of pressure. If you have a capable person with you, try asking them to attach one end of a lunge line to the trailer and then lift it from behind her and touch it on her flanks to try and illicit some movement (obviously not to haul her in!) if she moves lower the line, so it is still pressure and release. If you go for this I personally wouldn't apply any pressure via the line to her head other than to keep her straight.
|
|
|
Post by rifruffian on Nov 20, 2014 20:28:59 GMT 1
hullo s-babe. It is noted that you are unable to arrange to fly-in an RA. Where are you located ?
|
|
|
Post by janwilky on Nov 22, 2014 9:29:44 GMT 1
Great advice given already. Just to add an owner's perspective and say it does get better with practice I have a big gelding who did exactly what you describe, he would just plant at the bottom of the ramp and refuse to budge. His eyes would glaze over, he'd rest a hind leg (interesting explanation from SarahW, not heard that before) and he'd stay there for hours if necessary. If I put too much pressure on he would become explosive (he was that way inclined at the time anyway). The main strategies I used were a combination of clicker training and going out for very, very short and slow journeys. Then we built up to going out regularly to places - mainly one place - that I knew he really enjoyed. I made a pact with him that we would never travel for more than 2 hours (initially it was much less than that), and if I had to go further than that for any reason I would look into hiring a lorry or using a professional transporter. This seemed to really help, as the loading problems started after we'd been on long trailer journeys (up to 4 hours) several times. Loading became much easier, but then he became more difficult loading to come back! But we kept working on it regularly and now he's a reliably brilliant loader, he just walks straight on with no pressure at all. I always give him treats after he's loaded, I want him to see the trailer as a nice place where he gets lots of treats, so he gets a big fat haynet and I also give him several more lots of treats while we're getting ready to leave and also when we arrive. Because we've done clicker training he's very polite about treats and knows he can't pester for them, so I don't find this is a problem but it all helps to keep him relaxed and happy. He's now actually much better at loading than my mare, who is a seasoned traveller but goes through phases of being reluctant to load so I need to follow this advice for her too! I've been thinking I might do a bit of clicker training, I've never done it with her but I think she'll be very responsive to it. She only plants for a few minutes but it's still enough to be annoying when you need to get going. I might even go and do a bit today...
|
|
|
Post by mags on Nov 25, 2014 17:04:58 GMT 1
Another personal experience: My gelding, who had always loaded "fine" suddenly stopped loading on the way home. He did the same - planting at the bottom of the ramp. Fortunately, I seem to have managed to nip it in the bud. I learned two things from the episode: 1) My leading/loading wasn't that good to start with. Yes, he loaded fine at home, but with some outside insights, I realized that he was always loading on his own terms (first sniffing the ramp, making up his mind whether things were safe, then climbing in). So, I practised more at home, mostly general leading practise (somewhere on the yard) to make sure I had full control over leg movements, then loading without the stop/sniff. I kept a bucket with sticky senior musli mix in the lorry as a reward. 2) Since the first episode of planting was when leaving the 5-day foundation course (ahem!) I had expert help at hand. Kelly ended up loading him, and found that he didn't respond very well to the Dually, but panels got him loaded in quick time. I think if I found myself in a similar situation again, I'd see if I couldn't arrange things somehow to restrict the space behind him (e.g. parking along a fence, with a gate that swings behind the ramp, or similar. If away, maybe people holding rugs between them as a sort of "panel"). Then back to point 1) - get leading/loading at home perfect, and hopefully loading away from home will get easier. Fingers crossed, we haven't had any problems in a while.
|
|
|
Post by squidgybaby on Dec 3, 2014 12:54:05 GMT 1
Hi All, thanks so much for all the tips given. As an update the weekend just gone was the first time I'd had to try some of the tips out, she had actually become quite sticky loading at home as well so I just had her going into the box and back out again. First time was a bit sticky, second time was really sticky - she was pawing the ramp and putting her teeth on the raised wooden bits (the one's that stop them slipping)two feet on the backing off however she loaded after a few minutes. After that it was as if something clicked and she was walking up the ramp with me. Then one of the other liveries was walking across the car park so I stopped at the bottom of the ramp to talk to her, the next thing I know, I'm stood on the car park with my horse in the box as she's just loaded herself. Every time she had loaded she got a few bits of carrot in a bucket and a bit of hayledge in a net. I think that would class as a small step towards success. rifruffian - I'm in the Isle of Man Gary - I used the same techniques that were in the video you shared so thank you very much the other thing we noticed was that she had a lot of trouble turning round or getting in the right place as if we were going to shut the partitions, it looked like she didn't like her bum touching the side of the box and she seemed to get a bit worried to the point of unloading herself again so I worked on getting her in a better position to allow her to turn easier. I've got to remember that there is a whole lot of horse in my hands and I'm really trying to see what she is telling me. Sometimes this can be so hard when a few of my friends are saying that I'm just reading too much into things Thanks again everyone x
|
|
|
Post by lesleyking1 on Dec 3, 2014 18:31:38 GMT 1
I think we can over think, but this is different to reading your horse, stick with your own instincts and listen to the advice that's helpful only, unless they really are experts, got many RAs on your yard, got loads on mine lol
|
|
|
Post by clipclop on Dec 3, 2014 21:38:48 GMT 1
You've already been given suggestions and sound like you've made progress which is brilliant.
Just remember to check that she's not being sticky to load for a reason - check tyre pressures on trailer and towing vehicle, trailer breaks, floor, ramp, suspension, grease the tow ball and of course ensure that all driving is very smooth and careful. Also ensure that breast and breeching bars are fitted snug to ensure they do their job.
Sent from my GT-I9195 using proboards
|
|
|
Post by janwilky on Dec 8, 2014 15:59:20 GMT 1
That sounds like very good progress indeed, well done I've been practising with my minxy little madam too. It turns out that one sight of a bucket and she trots up the ramp to get her reward
|
|