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Post by lisap on Mar 21, 2012 19:32:14 GMT 1
When reading through all the various threads where people are worrying about their horses' behaviour, weight, metabolism, etc etc etc. there is loads of advice about ulcers/IR/pain/and so on and so forth, but hardly ever any advice about work.
Every professional will tell you the same thing - if you want behaviour to improve, there is no substitute for Hard Work. This means riding a horse until it is puffing - trotting/cantering up and down steep hills (and here in Cheshire that is a bit of a challenge in itself!), long hacks out at all three paces and plenty of faster work - ie long trots, plenty of canters.
Having run a trekking centre in my youth, with 24 horses and ponies of all shapes and sizes, we had absolutely none of the issues that crop up time and again on this board. None of our horses were fat, none had saddle related issues, no bad/spooky behaviour. If a horse had a problem it was an obvious physical one. Every horse worked at least 2 hours a day 6 days a week in the summer months, and had a complete break of 3 months in the winter.
I'm currently working with the Greater Manchester Mounted Police Unit, and strangely - none of their horses have any of the problems that concern so many of us here on the board either. And they all work at least 2 hours a day 6 days a week as well. So, are we actually avoiding the real issue here?
Are our horses and ponies just woefully under-worked?
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pipgibson
Grand Prix Poster
Pip Harrison & A Spot Of Bother.xx
Posts: 2,107
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Post by pipgibson on Mar 21, 2012 19:45:12 GMT 1
I really think you've made a great point here Lisa. I used to work at a trekking centre on the Mendip's and the horses there would do at least 4 hours a day!! In the riding shcool or hacking out, Some did day rides where we'd stop for lunch for 1 hour at the local pub. Again NONE had problems...... My horse thrives on his work, I do 3 faster longer rides out a week, Mostly at a trot & a fair few canter's, ranging from slow one's to a bit of a blast!!! The other year we trained for our first Endurance race & we trained 35km's, which he lapped up like a daily ride!!! I do admit at the moment we are in between moving yards again so we've not been doing as much, Once we have moved it'll be all systems go. So, Yep.. I agree work work work.......
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Post by kizi on Mar 21, 2012 19:47:13 GMT 1
Possibly. The other side of that coin tho is-are those others who don't have so many problems actually listening to their horses... But I agree with you. As I have a lot of rehab or out of work ones here some through neglect etc, as they get fed and stronger etc but are not yet ready for work they can begin to misbehave and first step is an increase in exercise.. If that doesn't resolve a behaviour issue then I keep looking... I have 2 with weight issues but am looking at forage and ground analysis first as I think there's a slight imbalance. For the flip side-I have a neighbouring yard where all horses do several hours a day and long hacks/hunting etc They don't ever have vets or osteos etc... However Their horses are in pain and I can see it, but if they try to misbehave they get a lash of a whip...
There is a lot lately on here of all that you mentioned and I did wonder the same but also that the difference is we're listening caring and wanting the best Interesting topic....
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Post by kizi on Mar 21, 2012 19:48:29 GMT 1
Ps not implying that your not listening!!! I gues there's more than 2 sides to the coin!!!!
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natty
Olympic Poster
Posts: 652
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Post by natty on Mar 21, 2012 19:56:48 GMT 1
I agree to that to an extent but I remember growing up where people had there horses for a certain purpose and was always to make money, so in my eyes yes exercise has a lot to do with it but I do think now a days people care more about health conditions and ways of training rather than smack them with a whip constantly until they do as they are told, I do have proof that this happens a friend of mine was brought up "old school" until she met me and I refused to let her do anything with my horse unless she treated her with the respect she would give me, she then practised with her horse and yes the horses behaviour changed and so did the health, she gave her horse the chance to show something was wrong now £3000 vet bill out the way and they have a perfect partnership :-)
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Post by specialized on Mar 21, 2012 19:59:33 GMT 1
I agree that we tend to be much more sympathetic towards our horses and what was not considered a problem in the past is recognised as an issue now that we know a lot more and science has given us more treatments and cures, and perhaps we do look for more answers than we used to. In my case we are coming up against old age as many of ours have had busy competitive endurance careers involving a lot of work (not necessarily without physical problems) however our issues are not behavioural but real physical issues that will start to appear with any 20yo. I don't believe in looking for things that don't exist, but if one of my horses says something is wrong it would be negligent not to investigate. I do worry that the answer to every behavioural problem these days seems to be ulcers - they can't all have them.
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Post by highlanderpony2002 on Mar 21, 2012 20:17:27 GMT 1
Over fed and under worked will contribute to a mass of problems as will stabling to keep clean and in unnatural surroundings. Too many and varied fancy rugs and smothering rather than genuine horse sense. Those that are guilty will protest I know and I will be shot down in flames but in general horses are treated as humans too often. The good things are a more respectful and kind treatment but I know horses that have a day off after one local dressage test where they work for only a few minutes
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Olivia
Olympic Poster
Sparrow's Flight
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Post by Olivia on Mar 21, 2012 20:20:18 GMT 1
I completely get where you're coming from, my horses have always been healthiest when I had the time to have them really fit etc BUT, what are the people that work/study away mon-fri or dont finish work til 6pm in the city supposed to do? Not have horses? And should I be taking my pony out of retirement and riding for 2 hours a day because I shouldnt be restricting his grass? I can only ride at the weekends so I do the best I can. Yes, that means my fat pony is on restricted grazing, and I have to watch what I feed them in terms of sugars/starch etc. In an ideal world, I'd LOVE to be able to ride for hours every day hacking about, but I cant. I have to study, so I can work, so one day I will be able to ride for hours. But by then my current horses will long since have arrived at rainbow bridge, so theyll just have to suffer in their work-free lives
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Post by ellibell on Mar 21, 2012 20:35:27 GMT 1
Lisa in one way I agree, work does solve a lots of issues, but having worked at GMP mounted , those horses still do have lots of issues and problems, more so then the subjects putup on here. Theirs are physical and mental issues. I have 2 of mine in well I would call it really not work, but ok lets say light work. Due to my physical pain I am unable to work them hard but with management, thety are healthy and happy, but then again I dont over feed, and they get a lot of turn out on rough moorland grazing. Problem is around here (Lancs) livery can be rather expensive, with either ex dairy grazing or over grazing or no turn out. There really are hardly any (not counting Jen1, who is I think tech in yorks lol ) that offer what the horse needs. This combined with folk having to work every hour they can to support themselves in this climate, means most horses tend to be prone to all these issues. I know up to 10 years ago (when my body brokedown) , light work for mine was classed as 1 hour a day hacking walk trot and canter... hard work, which was what they got was 2 hrs hack and 30 mins schooling a day, week days and 8 hrs hacing at weekends and shows on sunday jumping 3 - 4 big classes. And they all lived to a ripe old age, it was the pony who developed met probs from picking up some poison a few years ago.
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Post by Yann on Mar 21, 2012 20:40:43 GMT 1
I think it's a valid question - I've often thought that when laminitis prone horses and ponies were being discussed, the advice is always about diet and restricted grass and getting the horse out working often comes a distant third.
I'm not sure it's just about 'work' though, work involves lots of movement and mental stimulation and I wonder if that element is what really counts if we're talking wellbeing and lack of tension in a horse. Although we often don't have a lot of choice about it many of our horses are kept in small paddocks with limited company and I think that the way we keep them can be as much of an issue as the amount of work they get.
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Post by doryfish on Mar 21, 2012 20:49:01 GMT 1
Not really sure how work will combat a saddle fitting issue, if you saddle doesn't fit it doesn't ft!!! But agree about the rest
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Post by mandal on Mar 21, 2012 20:55:06 GMT 1
Imo exercize/work is extremely important but of course how much and where depends on how capable the horse is if there are issues.
I do agree many horses don't get anywhere near enough work as a preventative. Also with increasing numbers of barefoot horses these issues are brought to the fore...
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Post by jen1 on Mar 21, 2012 21:03:03 GMT 1
i dont go out to work but i still find it hard to keep all 3 of mine in what i call puff and blow kind of work, when i worked on the hunting yard we used to trot horses for a full 2 hours per day, x 3 rides out, id love to get back to lead riding but traffic just spoils it, i agree about fitness but i also think we need to listen to our horses, and stop feeding them so much,
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Post by wabuska on Mar 21, 2012 21:30:44 GMT 1
Yes, yes and yes... I think we often analyse a simple problem of under-work and over-feeding into worrying about metabolism, LGL etc., I'm afraid I'm with you Lisap, and often feel that way.
I'm currently working a 12.2 every single day. It's hard work but has to be done. She's a native type and can't be left listing in a grassy field or hanging around on hard standing where I or she would go mad. I let a horse in my care get horribly fat four years ago, and I still feel ashamed. Hard lesson to learn.
Years ago when horses had a job, there were far fewer problems.... well of the fat kind anyway. I know it could easily go too far the other direction with hat racks out hunting three days a week.
That question of should we own horses we don't have time to work? Well, surely if we barely have time to work one, don't get two. That's certainly why I came to my senses about a second horse.
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Post by jill on Mar 21, 2012 22:00:56 GMT 1
I agree about the work angle but there is also the management angle - I'll bet horses in those kind of jobs didn't get proprietory brands of feed for starters, at best it would have been straights, barley, bran and oats. I think we are nearly all victims of the marketing men, who sell us an image of our horses being three day eventers when in reality they are happy hacking natives or cobs. The pictures in the ads tell it all - when did you see an ad featuring a very very healthy condition score 3 lovely hairy cob? They are all TBs or TB crosses at the peak of fitness for competition, and so we buy the product with our aspirations of being the best we can be, so then we over feed, and don't have the time to work them. Sorry, but I see teenage girls with lovely kind generous natives - and matching kits of saddle cloths, travelling boots, saddle carriers and embroidered jackets even though they have never in their lives been to even a local show. They want to live the dream and the horses get stuffed with expensive food the marketing men tell them they need. Sorry, hobby horse but grrrr at the advertisers.
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