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Post by spanishmustangsuk on Dec 31, 2006 9:15:51 GMT 1
I think that there is a danger that just because someone is on the IGDG it may be assumed that the advice they give is IH. Unfortunately, unless you have done all of the courses, you may not be doing it the IH way at all. I would like to point out that there are other forms and methods of dealing with horses intelligently, without being a member, RA, or studying IH. There are many other teachers out there that haven't built a commercial empire around their teachings. Just because someone hasn't done the IH courses does not mean they don't know how to deal with a situtuion safely, humanely and effectively. No one system is fool proof, or suits everybody. The intelligent person will visit many clinics, and many teachers and pick and choose what works best in any one situation for themselves. Having letters behind your name doesn't necessarily make you better or more qualified than a person without... For all you know that person might have spent a couple of months catching and gentling wild mustangs, and learning from someone who has done it all their lives, and whose father did it before them etc... Then it is the seeker's responsibility to sift through the dross, and choose what they use, even if it is to admit defeat and call in an expert. As to sedating a weanling filly to put a halter on?...really!! It is like killing a mosquito with a bullet.
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susan in greece
Olympic Poster
"you can't stop the waves, but you can learn how to surf" Joseph Goldstein
Posts: 556
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Post by susan in greece on Dec 31, 2006 10:42:14 GMT 1
i've not read the thread but would just like to say that the power of the internet is a double edged sword surely. it can offer help and advice and be a lifesaving link but the reverse is also possible. yes, of course i think 'we' should all be sensible and not promote dangerous practises but real world is dangerous and people say daft things. what should we do ? censure everything? moderate the lot? prohibit young people from accessing this resource? sorry, but for me this is not an issue of horsemanship as such but the subject of the internet as a source of info and help.
and also, i find the english way of wrapping everything up in cotton wool just so...well english. horses are dangerous, the internet is mostly a load of rubbish. would we change either?
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Post by Zoe RA on Dec 31, 2006 11:18:24 GMT 1
Firstly, it would be very helpful if the whole thread could be read before anybody posts. This will avoid having to repeat what has already been said
Spanishmustanguk, yep, that is what I have already said - Intelligent Horsemanship is intelligent horsemanship. If you would care to re read my earlier posts you will see that Kelly Marks herself says as you have said - an idea isn't bad just because it isn't written in a book or come from someone with letters after their name!
Susan in Greece, a double edged sword in deed.
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Nessie
Intermediate Poster
IH Member
Posts: 169
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Post by Nessie on Dec 31, 2006 12:48:04 GMT 1
. Regardless of our beliefs in horse training, all advice should at a minimum be: - safe for both horse and handler - fair on the horse - not counter productive Good post LizP. I'm sure I'm not alone in thinking that some suggestions, which may have sounded good when written, in the cold light of day are just not feasible. We all have different levels of knowledge, experience and comfort zones; just because it worked for our horse dosen't mean it will automatically work for yours. If we remember these points before we press " Post reply" then be will be posting in the sprit for which this forum exisits.
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Post by SarahW on Dec 31, 2006 16:50:54 GMT 1
Hence my use of capital letters for IH. Intelligent Horsemanship with capital letters is a brand name and just because someone comes on the IHDG doesn't mean that they are using Intelligent Horsemanship methods. Intelligent Horsemanship methods are those actually taught by Kelly and her team at the Intelligent Horsemanship courses. Other techniques may be intelligent but they are not necessarily Intelligent!
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Post by SarahW on Dec 31, 2006 17:04:38 GMT 1
And incidently I do attend a lot of clinics and learned something from all of them. I have learnt from someone who has trained a lot of mustangs and I have worked with a lot of untouched/semi-feral ponies myself. I have also witnessed the aftermath of people lassoing horses - ponies that are terrified of ropes, ponies that have run straight through barb wire fences and ponies that have ended upside down in ditches (this latter performed by someone advertising themselves as Parelli). The first rule has to be to get them into somewhere where it is safe to work for both the horse and the handler.
Still, I've only worked with 400 horses since I became an RA so what do i know.........
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Post by SarahW on Dec 31, 2006 17:12:48 GMT 1
Sorry, I seem to be on one this afternoon.....
Having had a quick count up this afternoon, I started to look at how many horses' names repeat themselves. My best advice is not to call you horse Sunny or Molly!! I've worked with five of each.
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Post by janetgeorge on Dec 31, 2006 18:37:59 GMT 1
Sorry, I seem to be on one this afternoon..... Having had a quick count up this afternoon, I started to look at how many horses' names repeat themselves. My best advice is not to call you horse Sunny or Molly!! I've worked with five of each. Know the feeling - we've backed 2 x Sunny in the last 18 months. And had 2 x Molly to the stallion at the same time - and there was a Mattie, a Maddie, a Milly AND a Tilly visiting at the same time too - thank goodness we only had one stallion at the time! Then I bought two new mares - one called Pride and one called Rosie - we already HAD a Pride and a Rosie! As the two new ones were potential mounts for husband, I asked him what he thought we should call them - he suggested 42 and 43! (Strange sense of humour my OH has!)
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naria
Grand Prix Poster
yet when all books have been read it boils down to the horse, his human & what goes on between them
Posts: 1,455
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Post by naria on Dec 31, 2006 19:25:58 GMT 1
Thanks Sarah W - I've got a SUNNY Jim . . . could explain a lot! Tonight I also had to rescue an owner from a cob called Sunny that was going nuts in the gales & rain - & I sooooo wanted to get soaked when I'd just changed into dry clothes Will definately avoid all Sunnys in future (apart from Jim ;D)! Can't agree on the Molly front though because the couple I've known havebeen worth their weight in gold - could I rename Jim Molly?
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Post by smudge on Dec 31, 2006 21:10:13 GMT 1
Could I just make a small point about advice? Yes, some advice given can be a tad dodgy, or even dangerous - BUT it very hearteneing and very educational to see someone with experience on the board explain the reasons WHY that advice is not a good idea... far better it is said and challenged than not said at all Sedation hadn't occured to me until I read that thread - and the reasons given for NOT using it were very useful to me meaning I would immediately rule it OUT as an option if I was ever in a similar position So yes, I agree - some advice should not be given - but better it be offered on here than on some yard somewhere where there is no-one to challenge it
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scatcat
Elementary Poster
Posts: 99
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Post by scatcat on Dec 31, 2006 22:00:38 GMT 1
i agree with you smudge. just because advice is given, it does not have to be taken.
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kofihorse
Grand Prix Poster
Oh,such a perfect day, I'm glad I spent it with you
Posts: 1,454
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Post by kofihorse on Jan 1, 2007 11:53:19 GMT 1
a vet once told me that his heart sinks anytime he's called out to any horse called "Kevin" LOL
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Post by touchstone on Jan 1, 2007 12:54:05 GMT 1
I think it boils down to the responsibility of the original poster as well though, they need to be aware that the advice may not always be the safest or the best, and it is up to them to question and try to understand the reasoning behind suggestions in order to learn and progress. I am quite happy to take all opinions on board, but I see it as my responsibility to work out whether certain methods woud be feasible or safe rather than following blindly any old advice someone has posted on a DG (although on the whole I have to say it is usually pretty good advice!)
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Post by calamity on Jan 1, 2007 13:41:35 GMT 1
Wow, Kayron, you have a bee in your bonnet and maybe something missing in your understanding of horses and horsemanship. You might broaden your view by reading a few good books. Have you been through the Monty books? Read anything by Mark Rashid? Kellys books are certainly linked to this better understanding of the horse.
LizP has a point for sure. I hope anyone asking for advice will be sensible enough to get real live help too if serious issues are involved. This forum is a great place to express concerns and get ideas but as Liz says, advice isn't always the best. Having said that, I have had some great help from several knowledgeable people on here, some of whom pointed me in the right direction and gave me helpful addresses and names to follow up. This forum can be a real friend.
Thanks Lizp for drawing attention to this important issue.
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Post by janetgeorge on Jan 1, 2007 14:55:40 GMT 1
Yes - it was a good point and well made. I DO tend to mention methods which may have risks or downsides - if only on the basis that someone, somewhere, WILL suggest them - usually without warnings. I always 'qualify' any 'methods' that carry risks and what they are, because you DON'T know how experienced the person you're 'advising' is and whether they'd be capable of trying that 'method' safely.
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