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Post by 2 bays & a grey:D on Jan 8, 2013 13:05:55 GMT 1
I just wish people just dint have to cope, if liveries were zoo, s we would all be up in arms with animal kept in small cages, I woulnt even be on a yard with sub standard facilties, I know lots of folk will moan they dont have choices, id say think about the zoo analogy and say horses have less choice because we refuse to seek them out Unfortunately Jen people do have to cope, as livery, which is in driving distance reasonably for most, isnt always as ideal as we would like. Luckily my horses are menatlly stimulated as I work from home so can spend all day at the stables doing stuff with them, making sure they get other horse contact etc. Not everyone is lucky enough to have that. Also, with the way the weather has been the land just hasnt coped. But, I know that long term I am seeking better for my horses and will not always be in any livery . I just have to wait
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Post by jen1 on Jan 8, 2013 13:19:07 GMT 1
Yes but it still does not make it right, what im talking about is raising the bar on standards, I bet 80% of places would be shut down if they were to meet a simple standards , going back to what bertie horses should be freee to roam and make choices being kept in more agricultural set ups would solve some of it, 12x12 cages would not be an option for any horse I own or look after, unless they were tiny ponies, yes im 42 now and pre mentral, but the standard of what really matters to a horse should be met or just dont have horses, the bar on what is acceptable has been pushed tp the limit in my book
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Post by becca00 on Jan 8, 2013 13:49:30 GMT 1
Most of the horses at our yard are out 24/7. Gateways very muddy with a couple of them almost a foot deep in mud, but the rest of the fields not too bad. Still just enough for them to have a bit of a graze plus big round bale of hay in each field. Farmer limits us to a bale a week so if they run out we all sneak out undercover of darkness with the huge white building sack things full of hay!!
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Post by 2 bays & a grey:D on Jan 8, 2013 14:07:45 GMT 1
everything in an ideal world . Unfortunately we dont live in one. And having horses in fields where just the gate is muddy is fine if you dont want to bring them in to work them, or do anything with them. But having horses walk through such deep mud on a daily basis, twice a day, in my opinion is asking for an injury. After my horses have been out in it the following morning their legs have filled, yet interestingly, being in 24/7 and not straining their joints, their legs dont fill. I agree Jen standards on the whole should be raised as regards livery yards but, in reality, there are too many horses for the amount of land we have in the UK. If we had the same land, same population as some of our European neighbors then I am sure livery situations would be better. In an ideal world for me, all yards would have a large concrete turnout area, pens outside the stables so they can roam in and out. Acres and acres of land and all gateways with excellent drainage and hard standing. I have always condemned horses being in 24/7 but, this summer/winter has been diabolical and actually, I believe my horses seem happier in. No mud rash, no filled legs, no pulls or strains, in close proximity with each other, regular walks and turnout in the sand arena to have a roll and a mooch. Its costing me a fortune and hard work as Im mucking out twice a day and skipping out in between, having to exercise all 3 and keep them stimulated. But I would rather that than a vets bill or a horse fence walking because she would rather be in
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Post by rrosie on Jan 9, 2013 13:25:59 GMT 1
We are lucky because we can pretty much organise our turnout as we like, as long as no horse is left out alone. The gateways are grim but I seem to have more problems turning the horse to re-do an electric tape gate than walking through it! Losing wellies is a definite hazard..
However the mud and weather do seem to have taken their toll this year, small Jade always comes in at night so that she gets enough to eat but normally the two larger mares stay out quite happily, this year however they have asked to come in more and more, before Christmas they stayed in for three days with a couple of hours turnout entirely because they wanted to. After re-charging their batteries they were happy to go out again overnight, I have never known this before. Strangely it isn't even that cold!
I'm afraid the ability to organise my own turnout is one of the primary reasons for choosing the yard, as well as it being a nice place, as I really do not believe in keeping horses in confined spaces for too long.
Additionally all three of my mares have boxes which have direct physical access to their neighbour so they can touch, talk, steal hay from each others mouths, bicker and sleep very happily. I think this is hugely important, as much as turnout in some ways.
Rrosie
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madmare1
Grand Prix Poster
The Gruesome Twosome
Posts: 1,500
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Post by madmare1 on Jan 9, 2013 22:48:00 GMT 1
My 3 can all interact with their neighbours, or not as they choose to, all get exercised daily, lunged/ridden/walked out in hand/turned out. Each has their own individual character, and I never let them get bored. I'd rather have that and 3 happy horses, that is important to me. Not drving, I have to consider travelling time/bus routes to and from the yard.
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wills
Grand Prix Poster
Posts: 4,657
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Post by wills on Jan 10, 2013 20:12:43 GMT 1
mud seems to be the biggest factor then ;D
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orangetails
Intermediate Poster
Jay, Lilly and Tangle
Posts: 219
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Post by orangetails on Jan 11, 2013 13:20:00 GMT 1
It has been crazily wet this year - I've been on my current yard 8 years, and I have never known the track and fields like it. The amount of rain we've had has been ridiculous (this is north Hampshire so I think we have fared better than those further north)
Fortunately the yard I am on is DIY and we have our own paddocks, so we can choose exactly how we want to manage our horses and our turnout. We can't really get away with not bringing in at nights over the winter as we don't have a massive acreage per horse (must be lovely to keep horses in areas where land is less of a premium, but round here, pretty much every yard is technically 'over-stocked') I have two paddocks for two horses and a companion pony - my biggest paddock is 1.1 acres, my smaller one is just over half an acre. So I certainly don't have the desired 'acre per head'. However with careful management even in this wet winter I still have grass, and the only poached area is immediately inside the gateways. The front of the field shelter has suffered a bit too, but none of it is 'lose your wellies' type mud.
My horses have had the very occasional 'duvet day' (my choice) and one of them was in 24/7 for the late summer/early autumn due to mud fever (which she is very prone to and somehow got in June this year - I think the excess of clover has been an issue for her as she is chestnut and very sensitive - she also stood on her own leg and got it infected which really didn't help!) So she's had her fair time in, and is enjoying daily turnout (with me paranoid about her legs!!) now, despite the mud. It'll all right itself in the spring (I hope!!)
What I am doing this year is being a bit less obsessive about how long they are out for. Normally I like to turn out early and bring in late, so they get a good 10-12hrs out a day. This year, it's more like 8hrs, because they are well and truly ready to come in by 6ish, especially if the weather is foul (which let's face it, when hasn't it been?!) They have good rugs and a shelter, but they have still been gate hanging a bit this year which is very very unusual for them. However them being in a bit more does mean the field has a bit more time without 12 hooves on it, and they get ad-lib hay in their stables any way, so they might just as well be in there standing still and stuffing themselves as huddled in the shelter or by the gate. They mooch around grazing quite happily for the bulk of the day, picking at the grass - I haven't had to supplement with hay much this winter. Probably the winter regime of 'in at night' will continue a little longer than typical this year too, in order to give the fields the best chance to recover. Normally mine go out 24/7 for the summer around Easter, but I might delay it a bit this year - it depends what the ground and grass is like in a couple of months. At least it is always my choice, and I can still give them daily turnout even if it's a bit longer before they get to live out full time.
I'd hate to be on a yard where turnout was really restricted and it wasn't my choice - it's such hard work on the odd days when mine stay in to get them all mucked out twice, and exercised sufficiently. Would be something I'd dread if it was enforced for months on end - although I do accept a lot of yards and landowners have had little choice this year as it has been so unseasonally wet. I'd question more what was typical for a 'normal' winter - and also going forward what the plan was should this kind of weather hit us again - the climate is changing after all.
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Post by KimT on Jan 11, 2013 15:07:51 GMT 1
I think that's one of the worst parts of being in all the time. This weather isnt going to get better so livery yards/farmers need to get a game plan. Keeping unexercised horses and youngsters in all the time is not the solution.
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Post by wabuska on Jan 11, 2013 15:51:12 GMT 1
On the other side of the fence... so to speak.. having them out 24/7, it can be perilous getting them back in. I had to lead a lively 16.1 horse down breakneck mud off the hill yesterday, and I can assure you, jumping included, it was the most exciting thing all morning.
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Post by KimT on Jan 11, 2013 15:56:33 GMT 1
When I mean it's not the solution, I mean they could always look at gated yard they can stretch their legs in or bark/gravel ares, etc. Not just turnout. I know it will be an initial expense but it will be better in the long run for their liveries and maybe their pockets as I know a few people moving around due to no turnout. The yards which do turn out have massive waiting lists now.
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Post by somanyhorses on Jan 11, 2013 20:56:46 GMT 1
Until recently I thought at least 6 hours turnout in winter (and a lot more in summer) was the ab-so-lute minimum I'd EVER put up with on my horses' behalf. I thought they'd go balistic otherwise. Well, guess what?! The little buggers have refused point blank to go out on several occasions now. And on the few days where I have decided to give them a break from the hock-deep mud they've just gone straight back to bed with the most contented look on their faces. I am still surprised by it, but accept it now. They have stuff to do every day, they don't just stay in, I handwalk them, groom them, sometimes take them visiting with their friends who are also in, exercise them, .... but sometimes when they're in all day (after having been in all night!) they see me coming with a headcollar and just turn over in their beds and go "nah, not today, thanks, I'm quite happy doing nothing in my PJs today!" This awful weather has been a real revelation for me !
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arki
Advanced Poster
Posts: 364
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Post by arki on Jan 12, 2013 5:26:33 GMT 1
I have had my haflinger for 10 years this year and for the majority of his life he has been out 24/7 however with all the rain this winter I had to do something as him and my other 2 were knee high in mud. They were thoroughly miserable so I took the plunge and have stabled the 3 of them. I knew my cob and section a woudl be fine as they dont mind being stabled but my haflinger normally hates it. It has been a revelation - now he has realised that it is a dry place with nice hay and a treat ball to kick around - he is waiting to come in every day. I have moved them to a smaller drier paddock - the gateway is trashed but the majority of the paddock is fine. They go out at 5.30am and come in at 3.30 before I pick my son up from school. It is earlier than I would like to bring them in but they are waiting to come in and seem very happy. My dartmoors are out 24/7 with a field shelter and they spend most of their time in the shelter - again their field has been hit hard but I am hoping once it dries up to fence off the worst areas and to re seed by hand. Fingers crossed that we have seen the last of the really heavy rain x
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Post by shan on Jan 12, 2013 17:45:20 GMT 1
I can't seem to win... Sandy's been in since Monday so I can sort her MF out, she gets grazing in hand twice a day on the verge, she has scattered treats, a treat ball, veges, ad lib hay & salt/min licks. Yesterday was leg-wash day so I thought what the hell, put her out in the field while I muck out so she can let off steam (which she does, dramatically!), and what did she do - stood by the gate, didn't move! Yet she's bored staying in and will kick the door when I'm about. She'll be in for a good few more days yet too. Whaddaya do??
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Post by specialized on Jan 12, 2013 22:48:21 GMT 1
We normally keep ours out 24/7 until around December, then start overnight stabling of the ones in work with the others staying out. This year we had to start stabling in October to keep abreast of the mud fever, and the 24/7 turned out ones came onto the winter fields that have hardstanding and shelters. When we turn out the stabled horses they just look at us asking to come back in most days, but they are out 8 hours come what may. Some of the liveries have chosen not to turn out on the worst days, but that is their choice. The bonus is that come the dry weather I have some hayfields with loads of grass on them for late winter grazing as they have not been trashed. Those that want the ideal world for horses will never get it in this country unless they have common grazing as even restriction of fences in fields prevents them from selecting their 'ideal' location within the confines of fields. They may be in cages but the alternatives I have seen on tracks during winter do not provide the standards of care that the horses would choose, ie hock-deep in mud trying to get fodder from a round bale feeder.
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